Entitled? You think if people do NOT raid they’re entitled to raid gear? Really?
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Why is this needed in a solo game? That is what WOW has become over the years. Even if you’re doing group content there is no need for teamwork. Outside of Mythic+15 (or higher), Mythic Raids, or Rated PVP. This means that 90% (or more) of the player base are ultimately playing a solo game.
Even if I group up, I’ll never see that person again. Why do I care if they improve? Why do they care if I improve?
Have you played since Vanilla, or is your memory poor?
Most people have been bad at the game since day 1. A person says leveling in Vanilla was challenging? They had no idea what they were doing back then.
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If you do raid you have a higher chance of having better gear than someone who doesn’t. The same way I have more gear than a lot of players because I pvp and complete my m+ but don’t raid.
Raiding isn’t the only challenging game mode in the game and for each boss you down that another player doesn’t you have another shot at a piece of gear someone didn’t. Same way that if you didn’t cap the pvp bar I get a 385 piece at the end of the week that you aren’t going to get.
If you get a 385 from a world boss you think I’m going to be crying that you didn’t get 2.4k in pvp to get it? No I’m thinkin hope I get lucky and get that too.
Raiders seem to think that since they put together a massive group to kill an npc that they should have the best gear and the game and guess what they do. Where at all the 8/8 mythic raiders in here complaining about world quest gear?
Just because someone who doesn’t raid has better gear than you isn’t their problem it’s yours. Maybe your time would been better spent in game doing something else or at the very least not complaining about their gear on the forums.
The main reason Raiders complain more about this is because it cheapens raid rewards. (For the record I am in the camp, I don’t care what gear others have) But from a raiders perspective, they commit to at least two-three nights a weeks to raiding and have to work with 15-35 other people get the gear they want. Back before Warfronts and major Titianforging, raiding was the only way to get the best gear, so there was some prestige that went with getting that gear that motivated a lot of raiders. Back in the old day’s you would see a player with good/rare gear, you knew he must be pretty good. But now that means nothing. Now, someone can get the same gear as you by watching netflix and afking through a Warfront or doing a few world quests. This cheapens the rewards of raiders who dedicate a lot of time and energy to get this gear. This takes away the prestige of being a raider and cheapens their feeling of satisfaction when they finally down a really hard mythic boss they have been working on, only to see the boss drop loot that isn’t an upgrade.
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If I wanted to improve myself I would stop wasting my time on computer games and go CrossFit.
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I’m tired of leaving town for loot. Just put it in my bag while I dance on the mailbox
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And this is why Tier Sets and their bonuses should come back. They never should have been removed. This would give the raiders their additional incentive and even if another’s gear had the same ilevel number, it wouldn’t be as good.
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I played with a guy in Vanilla that was determined to be a melee mage. You can’t tell me that everyone always knew how how to play back in the day as if Vanilla was some sort of gold standard.
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Hits the nail on the head. It’s demotivational to see gear being handed out like candy. There’s not a reason to strive to be better. Why bother when you just log in and get gear.
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That’s just wrong.
I raided for years and when badge gear came out I didn’t like it at all. It didn’t do anything to my raid rewards, it hurt my feelings that I spend hours upon hours wiping and learning fights, and somebody could just get a similar reward (and in some cases better), without doing what I did.
I wanted to feel special. I had to look in the mirror and be honest why I felt this way.
I’ve never looked at loot the same way again.
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I can see what you mean. But at the same time I remember in legion season 6 my gear was nearly raid quality but in legion season 7 the raid gear was far higher again.
Before that we had instanced sepcific pvp gear that wasn’t meant for pve and pve gear was superior for world pvp.
I can see the direction you are taking. But the reward for a mythic boss is 385 I think? That’s 10 ilvls away from the current cap. These players have the best gear. Rightfully so right? But if you aren’t there you aren’t there if you can’t do the mythic raiding but are a raider. Don’t complain about the other gear because you aren’t good enough even to get the good gear from raiding.
Besides the new world boss and being over 2.4k in arena there is no other way to get a 385 without wf or tf.
As far as people spending their time in massive groups that is their choice to do that. It is something they should enjoy doing. Guess what if I didn’t enjoy doing timed dungeons, I wouldn’t do them? If I didn’t enjoy arena I wouldn’t do it? It’s what I play the game for, the same way raiders play this game to raid. Their rewards are still better just enjoy your content and shut up lol.
I agree with you. Taking tier gear away was a huge mistake. The azorite trait replacement is very lack luster and does nothing it effect your game play like old set bonuses did. Then on top of that they took away the cosmetic rewards as well (class specific mogs). They have gutted any insensitive to raid other than people wanting to complete the toughest content. There will always be people who want to be cutting edge for just the challenge alone but I have lost all motivation to raid for the first time in 11 years.
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BFA has made a big change to raid gear by taking away tier sets. That is a massive blow to raiders. Tier is what use to separate good raid gear from just random TF, at least to an extent. Plus tier gear changed up your gameplay and you had to adapt your rotation to utilize it. Now we just have a stat trait. So that is a huge incentive taken away from raiders.
The main gear argument is, if a guild is taking 4-5 months to work together to kill the hardest content in the game, they should be rewarded for that content. Because the satisfaction alone has proved to not be enough. If you look at raid logs, the amount of people killing raid bosses is less than half of what it was by this time in Legion. Many long term raiding guilds have quit this expansion. My guild has been raiding together since Mythic HFC and this raid tier is the one that broke us because it was no longer rewarding to many of my raiders. If you do your M+10 each week, the chances of getting an upgrade in Mythic raiding is not that great. This expansion has also forced Mythic raiders to do countless IE for AP so the amount of time a Mythic raider has to dedicate to the game is just not rewarded anymore. And when you add-on slow and boring gameplay, raiders just won’t raid anymore. That is why raiders are so upset right now.
In summary many believe, people competing at the highest level (Raiding or PVP) should receive a reward equal to the time and dedication they have put into the game that is all. The satisfaction of just raiding for the challenge has also been taken away when they gutted and slowed down class gameplay.
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Problem is he isn’t the only person making the guides… Plus they are often written somewhere.
Do you know how many times on these forums I’ve read “If you’re raiding for gear you’re doing it wrong…”???
Seriously I could retire to the Bahamas with how many times I’ve read that statement over the years. Or the fact that back when we had PVP gear and people would complain about the gear gap coming in late to the game and trying to catch up with the PVP’rs who had all the best gear and they’d just get slaughtered by them… the statements of ‘Get Gud Scrub’ populated those threads???
It isn’t that I necessarily disagree with what is going on in this thread, but the absolute flipping hypocrisy is to die for.
Yeah but back when badges were released:
- You could only buy a few pieces of gear with it and now you get a full set of Heroic raid gear very easily and in less time then you ever could under the badge system.
- There was a cap on how many badges you could get weekly and it would take weeks just to get ONE of pieces from badges. Plus the fastest/most efficient way to get badges was by killing raid bosses. I know you could get badges by doing your daily heroic and a few other things but that was it.
Now I can log on, do four quests and have a 370 piece without ever stepping foot in a raid, and I can log on every few hours and repeat the process. So I don’t think this is a fair comparison.
Well when you break down the basic essence of what an MMO RPG is suppose to be: work together with others to get better gear, and that process starts with your first lvl 20 dungeon. Why did people want to run the deadmines so mcuh back in Vanilla… it had the best gear for that level. To me raiding is just the final form of working together to get better gear. But I also know wow is not really an MMO RPG anymore so who knows.
What four quests do you need to do to get your 370?
Also please don’t compare time. If one group of people think it’s fun the time argument is irrelevant.
You don’t have to do ANYTHING to recieve this free welfare gear.
Except:
- pay rent or own a home.
- pay for electricity in said home.
- pay for a computer.
- pay for a copy of WoW.
- pay for a subsciption to WoW.
- level from 1-120.
- Do dungeons or other activitys to get to a IL to do a raid.
- Join up and do the raid successfully.
Yup all free and easy welfare gear. We hardly had to do anything to recieve all these handouts sprinkling from the sky.
Not a issue that you want to add 20 things onto that list just so you can control others and charge people gold. Not at all.
Go away. Once again we corner the point of the matter… gear. That tells me you don’t like to see others get it at all unless they pay you for it.
It’s not LFR that is bad for the game… it’s YOU.