Well for example, I remember when tanks were literally running away from the mobs because they were hitting so hard. So the tanks were obtaining threat, and then running away while dps went to work.
Thats not exactly a model that I want for dungeons lol. I thinks tanks should tank damage. My point is, once you enter those high keys, the damage is so high, the strat becomes do whatever you can to live through each encounter - even if its degenerative gameplay.
I agree that I donât want to be kiting all the time. I donât mind kiting occasionally, to buy group time, but I donât want that to be planned part of every pull lol.
By this logic, would you care if someone wasnât using their primary dps ability, if the run wasnât âgoing smoothlyâ?
Arguments like this are nonsensical. You can not do a lot of obvious, easily achieved things that gain group efficiency and still complete the content. If youâre not putting in at least some facsimile of your best effort, you are letting the group down.
Itâs absurd how many people are perfectly happy doing less than their best or something close to it in a group where success is shared between all members. Whose parents are going around teaching their kids âjust do the bare minimum, as long as you get by its fineâ?
If youre making the key at high levels, no one is twiddling thier thumbs.
The way I am, I would care more if I was one making mistake more than a team mate. I expect more of myself, and get annoyed when I screw up basics. Attention to detail! There are things I may never be great at, but thereâs no reason to accept being sloppy.
No, it means perma Rot damage Auras are dumb anyway.
Yes. I would care if the Paladin kept on Crusader Aura. I would get annoyed at it and probably eventually say something.
That would result in a significant DPS loss.
The 3% DR lost from no Devo is marginal. Thats not apt comparison.
Perma ones, sure. But mobs who might cast instant dot damage on the entire group? Now your group is taking rot damage.
But as you said, at those higher keys, it would add up to be too much. Sounds like trouble for a developer. Could be why, in part, were seeing higher HP pools in DF.
Yes, it is. There is a point, somewhere in the paradigm of M+ in totality, where that 3% DR is causing someone to die or not die, or causing a key to fail or not fail. Your argument is that it âdoesnât matterâ as long as the run is smooth. You can run with 4 people and the run will be smooth in many cases; that doesnât mean you should do it.
All the âlittleâ things add up; the more people fail to do them, the more likely you are to come across the cacophony of errors that leads to a problem where there otherwise wouldnât be one.
Stop doing less than your best, or expecting less than their best from others. If it happens from time to time? Sure, who cares. But to pretend like itâs not something to try to avoid or correct is utterly asinine.
Weakest link? Youre doing your job as a healer. If I keep your party alive, no one dies, and we complete the key, but I dont do any damage - youre going to pass on me next time I ask for an invite? Thats asinine.
Breath is around 20% of my damage and Iâm around 22% of the keyâs damage. So around a 5% total key damage loss if I donât press Breath of Sindragosa.
Not unlike Devo aura really or the Healerâs damage.
Maybe I should keep in mind to not press Breath in my next key ? You know, since weâll time it anyway.
Plenty of those. Theyâre usually dispell checks. They will melt you pretty fast at high level. The MK III bots in Workshop and their debuff come to mind.
Absolutely. Your job is not âto keep your party aliveâ; itâs to make sure the key succeeds, like everyone else. By refusing to dps, you prove beyond doubt that you are not willing to put in your best effort to do so; why would I invite you again when there is someone else who will?
I doubt anyone would not invite you to the next run for it. Check that DK above us though - saying he wouldnt invite the healer who doesnt add his 5% damage.
If you did somehow 20% less damage than youâre supposed to ? A FDK that never pushed the breath button even though heâs talented into it ?
Of course they wouldnât. Theyâd be dumb to invite you again.
Which is the same as a FDK not pushing breath when he has it. If you wonât invite back the DK would basically AFKâed your key, why would you invite the healer back ?
At this point, Iâm wondering if youâre not just wasting everyoneâs time here. What is your PvE experience in this game where youâre getting all these hot takes from ?
No thats not quite right. The ultimate goal of the party is to make sure the key succeeds. Each individual in the party definitely has their specified role. A healers is to keep HP bars green and make sure no one dies just like a tank should hold threat and DPS should do damage.
Well if you are doing 20% less damage, youre doing a lot less. The healer isnt only doing damage. Thats an off role that players are asking now. The healer is doing all the healing.
Thats not really a good comparison.
Youâre simply wrong.
There is NO specific requirement of any role.
You could go into a dungeon expecting the moonkin to heal and the holy priest to dps if you want to. You wouldnât, because that would be dumb, but you could. There is absolutely no reason why a healer who has access to dps abilities should not use them when no specific alternative action is better for the success of the party.
Overall, 20% less damage from a DPS that does 22% of the keyâs damage is a 4.4% overall damage loss.
So which is it ? Is 4.4% damage done significant or not ?
Youâre flip flopping now.
That totally depends on the tank.
And the type of content you want to cap at. Blizz designs for a certain level of difficulty. I dont think they design on players playing perfect either.
Although min/maxing is nice. Thre more dps means stuff dies faster. In timed content which the game is full of timers. More damage is usually warranted. When it comes to survivability. You are looking for just enough to get by and complete the content ideally.
More tanknyess is good to help healers out. But eventually there comes a point where more damage is preferable. More tankyness means less healing though to where supports can put more throughput towards the objective.
Tanks want more damage for threat and objective clearing. Damage is also a way of mitigating damage as well.
If your dps are losing threat and dying because of it. Your tankyness sort of gets undermined since someone died thus lowering your groups dps by like 25%>
The thing is, youre not also healing. Youre there for your damage. I, as the healer, am not. You would be slacking on your MAIN duty. Where as I am doing my main role completely(assuming no one dies and we key)
As I said, its not a workable comparison.