Once again, punishes casual players!

They never said that lol

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You’ve completed a single heroic dungeon. I’m not sure why you feel like you have an opinion on something you know literally nothing about.

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Yours is the strange one. If you’ve never done progression raiding, then you may not understand the amount of time and effort that goes into, along with the coordination and challenge.

The same can be said for high key M+.

This game has a gear ladder. It’s not a free to play everyone gets the same thing in a dying game system. You want higher gear, you run higher content.

It does matter for the system of this game and the fact that higher content rewards higher gear.

Since day one, this game has had a gear ladder. BfA muddled that a bit and it was one of the larger complaints about the expansion. I wasn’t running high keys, yet I ended up geared like I was from spending two seconds to kill a rare. And that wasn’t right. At all. That system was a disaster. This time, there’s a clear path to higher gear and it works perfectly. If you want that gear, you run the content that rewards it.

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I agree with you, i think you toss casual around too loosely like a lot of people on the forums, not to mention people toss “toxic” around like candy.

The community has made m+ very frustrating, the insistence to only bring meta classes makes it so anyone that plays off meta is basically screwed.

I probably would have never gotten KSM if I didn’t run with a group of friends for it, even though I usually outperform 90% of the “meta” during dungeon runs.

I have never gotten invited to a 15 from the dungeon finder and I think that’s just crazy, this is the first expansion it has been this bad and something is very wrong with that.

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Because I did m+ in other expansions. that is why? Of course you wouldn’t realize that because your a speed runner.

Prove it lol

You have zero achievements that say that.

Of course I know you won’t.

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Unfortunately its a harsh reality of wow that IO is a deciding factor on whether or not youre invited to a key, if you don’t want to put in the work to prove yourself you leave it up to luck. I have no problem finding keys and while I never said IO = Skill, being that I don’t know you and I don’t want to waste my time or key on a fail DK that probably can’t do mechanics, I wouldnt take you unless you had a decent IO.

Cry more bb

This is why I always recommend to others that they run it with friends. Lower keys don’t need a meta. So their group of friends or guildies can do this and have fun without worrying about pugs. Just like you mentioned. :slightly_smiling_face:

Speaking as a casual at ilvl 201 that almost exclusively solos, all I want is at least a small sense of progression so I can eventually go back and farm Legion raids and BFA dungeons. And make current content a bit easier so it takes less time - everyone wants that. But at this rate, will probably have to wait for 9.1.

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M+ isn’t even about speed running. If you do the dps that is appropriate for your item level and you don’t wipe, you will meet the timer every single time. Hell, on most dungeons you can even have a couple wipes and still time it.

Also, I have both AotC and KSM. I raid and do M+. They are both fun and challenging in different ways. It’s just absurd to say that M+ isn’t difficult content and is only about “speed running,” it really demonstrates you have no clue what you’re talking about.

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Lmao

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There are 4 tiers in my view

Hardcore IE you’re doing 16+, Mythic Raid
Semi Hardcore: Heroic raid M+ 10-15
Casual: N raid m+ 2-9
LFR hero: LFR

If you want better gear do harder content.

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I agree with this! :point_up:t2:

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All these people see is the timer and they tunnel on that.

They don’t care about the dungeons being inherently harder because of the affixes.

All they see is the timer and they just focus on that.

I suppose all the mythic raiders take off their gear when doing solo content? No, they don’t. Because its easier and faster to do it in better gear.

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What lmao?

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Please buy me dinner first

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There’s no way to discuss this with any level of decency before the attacks begin.
There’s a fundamental difference in thinking here.
There’s no such thing as progression to start with. You could argue it if the initial epic sets and raids stayed static. They don’t. Every major patch the bar moves up. Creating another set of obstacles to overcome. Raiders could easily do the content without a single upgrade and call just getting through the raid as progressive. That doesn’t happen.
So, progression is an illusion.
The illusion goes so far as to make it where those raiding and such are in fact tied to their gear even in their real life, defining themselves by the silly number of 235 or the like. That’s why if someone not part of that circle gets gear that’s equal to that another way, they lash out, which we see here constantly.
The fun and reward should be in just overcoming the challenge no matter it’s source, not what other folks have or don’t have compared to you.

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I am not saying my response is positive or should make you feel better.

but it appears to be months before 9.1 So in reality, even pretty casual players will have the time to gear up multiple alts using this time-consuming method.

The method works technically since there is going to be a huge content drought.

Working and being good/fun are different things though.

These kids are always the victim, no matter what they are giving it’s not enough and they are victims.

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