Like these total losers?
https://bigdumb.gg/news/bdg-disbanding
You nailed it. People are going to realize that it’s too much effort.
And that effort is trickling down as we speak. It’s making everything harder for everyone and at that rate there won’t be anyone left who gives enough of a turd to keep going.
But keep pushing them away. Bobby has his money and I’m sure Microsoft doesn’t want players to remain happy and paying, right.
Bro why are you feeding a troll thats probably never killed a single mythic boss. It makes the thread unreadable.
Also the content was ludicrously easy.
Most people who raid mythic don’t get CE. There are still plenty of people doing that though.
Even from a midcore persoective this kills guilds and communitys, receuiting its hard and keeping people in bench is hard fornthe bench theybwill eventually leave but also you need a bench ao when your main guys miss a raid.
Its just too much too many pieces need to align i think the best path forward its removing lockouts or reducing raid number to 15 or 10 its very hard to keep things rolling the logistics is what kills mythic raiding not even boses.
Once you reach smolderon/tyndral you have to deal with boses and logistics.
Fixed numbers are bad because you always need +1 or +2 more. When we raided 10-man Heroic back in the day we needed 11 or 12, just in case somebody couldn’t make it or their internet/power went out or whatever.
Or you belonged to a mega-guild with multiple raid teams that raided on different nights so people could fill in for the other teams.
The solution is to have Mythic scale with raid size, just like all the other difficulties. Then everybody actually gets to play.
Imagine being a theater owner and selling 25 tickets but there are only 20 seats inside, and then you ask the other 5 people to just wait outside all night. That’s what Blizzard makes us do with Mythic raiding. It’s stupid.
You know i was taking a final fantasy approach
But you are right i got 11/12 mythic nyalotha but i remember i had to go bench sometimes and it felt bad then i had to argue and prove myself out of bench to “steal” a spot.
In the end worked out for me but, both me and the other player had to spend weeks on bench without progging, then one day i decided to enter a myth prog and asked my gm if they will need me only to be messaged 10 mins later to go to raid.
You are absolutely right they need to keep 20 man for Raid to world first if they want then after a few weeks make it flex or make it baseline flex idk, just at some point make it flex.
Put RWF on its own tournament server with a forced 20-man cap if they want, but it should scale for everyone else. If there’s a 20-man minimum so be it but having to have 25 people on the roster and only being able to bring 20 into the raid is crap.
RWF shouldn’t be a factor; it’s for people who don’t play WoW, not for those who do.
While I think Blizz should increase accessibility for Mythic raiding. I don’t think flex raid size is the answer, it would ruin any competitive aspect of Mythic raiding outside RWF (which is largely irrelevant anyways). Flex will lead to degenerate strats, class stacking, and making it significantly harder to appropriately tune and keep an even difficulty for all raid groups across non RWF guilds.
Most of the commonly suggested remedies, like the above or even suggesting a tournament realm (creating a 5th difficulty to balance), have many downsides that may create more problems than they help solve. I think removing lockout restrictions and reducing the hall of fame size to open cross realm earlier would assist in reducing the flux of a raid team. The main issue for blizz here would be preventing lockout selling to guilds attempting to skip bosses, though im sure the solution would be a straightforward approach on blizz’s end.
Aside from flat out neutering difficulty across the board, the last approach I can think of would be for Blizz to stop the private aura/weak aura battle between themselves and the community. Going forward, the design effort they put in should be geared towards mechanics that don’t require complex positioning and or weak auras telling what player can do x based on y when z is happening. I have no issues with weak auras themselves and they are very useful tools, but when we end up with WA bosses like Neltharion, Smolderon, and Fyrakk, the same mechanics could be designed in a much more straightforward way.
One of my favorite examples is intermission orbs on Fyrakk. Instead of players being randomly assigned a debuff type, simply let the first orb they touch dictate what debuff they have for the remainder of the intermission. You still have to spread, you still have to soak the orbs, you still have to pay attention to the debuff and slide/rotate positions, but you don’t have to waste time on a WA failing because someone was dead, or someone missing an orb based on pre-assigned WA positioning they didn’t see or messed up. Then you spend the next 5 minutes looking at logs saying “oh 2nd red orb right side, who was that?” Pointing fingers saying but the WA put me here blah blah blah. Mechanics can still effectively play the same, but if designed in a more straightforward (arguably better) way, can go a long way in reducing artificially inflated difficulty and pull count; this could definitely assist in reducing burn out as well.
I think that combined with pulling back on the sheer number and frequency of pass/fail mechanics is somewhere they should go regardless of the presence of weakauras.
My example, perhaps not a good one, would be a mechanic like Echo of Nelth’s bombs. I think the difficulty should have come from ensuring that the drop spots where clear, not that players had to organize themselves on the fly within a few seconds to each pick 5 different spots.
The drop spots should have been easily identified and the difficulty should have been getting the tank and arrow targets to break the appropriate walls so they were accessible. The bombs should have been designated a unique animation that correlated to the drop spot marker.
Players would still have to react quickly and decisively, but there would be no ambiguity on who failed, no 20 minutes of wasted time trying to figure out why a weakaura didn’t work, etc.
so… fatescribe mechanics?
Solathra also has the better argument.
As for making it easier (they are with nerfs etc,) but wherever they lower it to, there will be people who want to clear, but can’t because it’s too hard. So, Deevax, where should they stop?
What about the counter argument.
CE used to be a joke, but it gets harder and harder every tier. When does that stop?
When 100 guilds clear the first boss?
CE was NEVER a joke.
The easiest it has been was Emerald Nightmare.
You probably played with better people back then.
Listen, I’ve seen what you’re about. At this point there is nothing you’re adding to this conversation. I’ve answered all the questions you keep asking. I’m gonna let go be a vitriolic tool to someone else.
Thanks for the bumps.
You don’t have an argument. You play with people that suck now, and CE is out of reach I guess or barely within reach.
Intelligence is knowing when someone’s opinion is wrong.
Wisdom is not bothering to argue on the WoW forums about it.
Narcissism is me making this post to point it out.
This is what Mythic raiding already is.
this is already happening people already do class stacks, and its not balanaced.
RWF, sure, of course they’re going to bring the most viable line up. I’m currently unaware of any boss that needs class stacking or specific comps to kill; maybe grouping ads on Fryakk, but several classes can deal with this. We need to stop pretending RWF shenanigans has much of any impact on the rest of the raid tier aside from WA creation and general strats (which doesn’t mean thats the sole viable way to kill a boss).
Flex will lead to, oh this fight is easier with 15 people and you’ll bench a quarter of your roster or more. If you’re gonna pick at an argument or provide a counterpoint, bring something of value to the conversation.
You think there’s anything comparable to mass DK grips on adds? You need the “several classes” just to get everybody within range of the mass grip.
Blessing of Freedom on Tindral roots?
Mass Dispels on Fyrrak P1 to help with Aflames?
Using 4-5 Immunities on Fyrrak 3rd orbs?
Grips/Rescues on friendly trees on Fyrrak?
And the class-stacking runs face-first into all the mandatory buffs you need now, which gets worse and worse with each new class they add, all while they refuse to overlap buffs (like they did in the Wrath era) and refuse to increase and/or flex the raid size.
What a Heroic raiding mindset.