Please allow oceanic instanced dungeons so you do not further alienate the oceanic raiding community as the competitive raid scene in the oceanic region will be eliminated if we have to try speedrun with 200+ping. We have oceanic instancing in retail so its possible.
2 Likes
You don’t need OCE ping for Raiding. And if you PVP in SOD, you have a way bigger problem than OCE ping.
1 Like
Im sure the US population would love to raid on oce ping
1 Like
It is pretty evident that you are correct, a lot of us played OG classic on 200 ping and killed a majority of the game all the way through to ICC in WOTLK. Heck I was a clicker back in OG Classic.
I am guessing you haven’t posted on a main because you realistically haven’t played in the competitive side of this game. I am not saying this to say that being a casual is bad, but just putting a blanket iT iS pOsSiBlE to raid doesn’t make it good. Playing games on a minimum requirements PC is possible but typically it’s a horrible experience.
The current real life example we have of this is in SOM, which you’re playing in a 40 man raid. As we all know 90+ percentile parses are typically achieved through decent kill times (although sometimes we can get lucky on RNG and pump one regardless). Pretty well anyone I have spoken to saying “its not that bad” has been in a US run where they are the only OCE player.
2.5% of the players in a 40 man run are OCE, this really isn’t going to impact kill time, and realistically with a bit of luck will leave room for a decent player to achieve good parses. You can compare two top guilds on SOM right now, Phase 7 (US), who one of our guildies is raiding with and Dragon Snack an Aussie guild.
If you compare just the boss kills, as these are more likely to be similar in time than the overall dungeon which there is a 14 minute discrepancy on. Phase 7 come out ahead (US guild) by 7%. Dragon Snack are achieving “good” logs. But 7% over a 30 minute run is a 2 minute difference, not only this but speeds typically have trash pulls being the hardest component of the runs so I would suggest that 7% is closer to 10-12% when looking at speed runs.
If you go back to the boss comparison only, due to the longer time frame of 14 minutes and warriors being the main dps component the longer run should achieve higher boss damage due to more uptime of Death Wish. However it doesn’t due to 200 ms - RIP
The TLDR of this post is, if you’re a casual, this ping change doesn’t really matter. You’re only clearing H1’s for the first month anyway. If this is a game you play to parse or speed it’s going to be relatively bricked.
2 Likes
The thing I don’t like about this narrative is it presumes it doesn’t make a difference to casual players either way. However, it is better for casual plays - who rely more on PuGs than guilds - to have access to a bigger community.
So, yes - it does disadvantage those casual players, so that the Warcraft logs raiders can maintain their parses.
As an extreme devil’s advocate opinion - if parsing is so important for OCE raid guilds (more important than having a thriving community), they can stay on OCE servers.
Assuming we don’t get seeded dungeons/raids.
You keep forgetting the part where they are disabling character creation on the old realms.
If you are coming from the casual side, which i assume you are based on remulos / penance you could always transfer there or create a toon on those servers. It would have no impact whether or not they opened transfers for you because a casual will raid in any guild and enjoy the game.
The problem people are talking about are the people that have been playing this game for a long time, who like to put in a bit more effort on gearing and strats to parse well / have fast clears. This directly affects that whole player base for the worse. Will fundamentally end the raiding scene for oceanic.
Adding my Western Australian voice to this. For NZ and Aus east coast players playing with ping to the US is crappy. For us sandgropers it’s extra awful. Please Blizzard, don’t kill Shadowstrike(AU). Do the opposite and make us a destination server. Some kiwis and aussies might choose to come home. Some US players who are not concerned with ping and like a less crowded server might prefer to come here than play on a huge mega server. And if the few players on Penance(AU) join us as well all that combined would surely move our population from “teetering on viable” (it honestly isn’t - we’re fine) to actually viable (by whatever metrics Bizzard is using to gauge this).
2 Likes
I’m not forgetting. It’s immaterial when the main counterargument is that 150ms+ latency would make competitive raiding mechanically unfeasible.
With respect to Sneakyflute, he has posited that mechanics are more important than community. If you have an OCE server with 80 dedicated raiders, that’s theoretically all you need.
Everyone else can go to NA.
More like 250ms+ for Western Australia, mate.
1 Like
Yeah, that’s regrettable.
You seem to be forgetting the part where the solution we are putting forward is to migrate. Which I have stated numerous times I think is a good thing for a number of reasons including gearing/leveling alts, rend heads. We are all aware that good population is great for the game and the general overall experience. But for Blizzard to use technology that already exists to allow us to host our own raids/dungeons through OCE servers so that we can remain competitive.
And I agree that the seeded instances is the best compromise. I’m also concious this was not raised by Blizzard (even if the tech exists in Retail) and we may be forced to pick.
No one said mechanically unfeasible? Unenjoyable is the word most people used. People play games for their own enjoyment.
No one has said all we need are 80 raiders, thats why people are speaking up. This is Brian levels of IQ right here. They are disabling character creation, meaning no rend / ony buffs. No new players to the server, only negative.
Blizzard please merge these aussies onto our servers so we don’t get stuck in horrendous laggy bgs for a minority of the PvP player base to be catered to. Thank you.
1 Like
Yes, they have. Sneakyfluke and others have articulated this position - that the game is perfectly functional for casual play on NA server latency, but not for high-end competitive parsing which requires pricise snapshotting, etc. Elron and others have been utterly hyperbolic in saying it is “impossible” to play melee on an NA server, and clearly have not played on one in years.
It’s only not “enjoyable” inasmuch if you don’t take enjoyment out of merely playing the content, and only when you excel at it.
Which is fine. But not everybody feels that way.
You talk a lot of rubbish you aren’t an oceanic player you hide behind a level 30 alt and your shaman that is on shadowstrike hasn’t even done any raids since bfd phase 1.
You don’t play the game at all as for me i actually do.
Elrondps - Swamp of Sorrows AU
Killed our server with transfers stayed on the server until last raiding guild fell apart “FORCED” to go to Jom gabbar NA
Elronfury - Jom Gabbar played there few weeks at most tried using exitlag (tunneling service) to help with latency issues went from 250ms to 200-230 fluctuating quit the game afterwards.
You don’t care about the oceanic region you aren’t an oceanic player and everything you say is malicious towards destroying our region.
With all due respect…
If me caring about oceanic servers ends with me suffering with and dealing with terrible shared instances that cause bad lag for the majority of the players for a small dead minority of players.
I really couldn’t care less about that minority of players experience.
Right now joining AU bgs literally turns matches into a power point.
dude its 100% brian
Demonstrably false, and I’ve posted on my SoD and Classic toons (not that I should need to, it’s irrelevant to my argument and your parses don’t make your arguments any more coherent nor make you any less disingenuous to argue with).
Transfers did not kill SoM OCE. SoM being a very niche game-mode in concert with OCE being a small region did. It was never sustainable, and you sound like a fool living in denial of the inevitable by repeatedly bringing it up.
Then fix your internet. And even if you didn’t, for goodness’ sake - it’s Vanilla World of Warcraft. This isn’t a competitive twitch-shooter eSport. You’re pressing one button per second on the GCD, playing around mechanics designed for keyboard turners. A 20-30 millisecond delay is only “unplayable” in the same way that a Toyota is “undriveable” to somebody who is used to driving a Porsche.
+1 for traction / until blizz makes a post about OCE.