If you want people to use a blend, you should provide the exact blend, and people can test it and determine if rio + x has a greater correlation with success than rio alone.
If it doesn’t, then there’s no reason for not using rio alone.
Please answer my questions in the post prior to this and I might be able to.
I’m Just trying to clearly before I make a wrong statement
Because of how easy it is to get gear, with Warfronts, WQs, M0s that lets you catchup, and Warforging/Titanforging.
I honestly don’t know how many, but 400 ilvl is not difficult to reach as a casual, but it may take more time.
I don’t know either, although with insane WF/TF luck it can be possible.
M+, and probably PvP. Mythic raiding if you’re a Mythic raider.
Because a lot of people (myself included) have super frequently found that performance of players at 400+ ilvl wasnt high enough to key even modest m+ dungeons especially compared to a metric of experience.
no idea. I don’t care about this.
A lot of 400+ players have lowish rio scores, which is the only experience that matters when i’m doing a key.
not sure, doesn’t really matter.
Fair argument. However, you should still be seeking to increase your IL. And someone like me, for example, who is sitting at 410 already, can’t really gear anywhere else. So it’s M+ 10 or nothing. It’s been that for me for a while too, ever since I was around 400.
Its a pretty common tactic to tag the mech jockeys and let them get in the machines, it gives a ton of %.
Nothing is more triggering than noobs that don’t know this and stun the jockeys.
Good 4 u.
You won’t see me making a forum thread telling you how to make your groups.
Sure, but if we have a theoretical player who’s never done a dungeon beyond heroic and reached 400+ through “luck” or trivial content, should they be jumping right into a +10 just because it’s where they get better gear? Or should they be running the dungeons on lower keys until they’ve worked their way up?
Expecting to march into a high key just because you have good gear is also wrong. Imagine we’re doing a Tol Dagor +10 on a Tyrannical week (for arguments sake), is a person’s 400+ gear score going to stop them from dying on the last boss when they move too much and get stunned into Cross Ignition or Massive Blast? Probs not. Their 400+ gear score also won’t stop them from stacking quaking on-top of others, or face-tanking necrotic stacks, or the myriad of other mechanics that require knowledge and experience to deal with (especially at higher keys)
Ideally you want a mixture of ilvl and IO. Obviously somebody who’s 370 probably isn’t going to contribute enough to a +18 regardless of their knowledge or skill because their characters potential is capped too low, but similarly someone who’s 400+ but doesn’t know mechanics isn’t going to be an asset either
I see why that happends. Tanks are lacking and DPS not, has nothing to do with RaiderIO.
I can assure you that if you switch your Ret to Prot you gonna get a lot of invites too.
Its a tool that creates division among the playerbase high / low , serious /non serious and such .Much like how ilvl and gear score used to do it. It expected but doesn’t last long
Some even defend their bad attitude because of XYZ inspite of them having a choice to be respectful or a degenerate. “Losers are toxic” …nope ppl are toxic because they choose to be toxic. Nobody put a gun on your head to make you say those words did they??
If you can’t control yourself then others will control you by poking you all day simple as that.
I’ve said multiple times its your group you do what you want. I’m not telling anyone what to do. I try to look at all sides of a disagreement and form my own opinions. At most I’m just suggesting people do the same.
It kinda does…just a little
Its very rare someone would have a total I lvl of 400+ without doing mythics+ or Raiding. Even hardcore pvpers complain about having to do pve for gear. No PvP vender. Not titan residue from pvp chest. Not to mention inconsistent rewards.
My whole point against R IO is its doesn’t show a measure of competence. It showes a measure of what’s been completed. It may be the best tool available for judging a player but it has flaws.
A gearscore doesn’t show competence either.
I was wondering the ratio of players who are 400+ and have failed mythics vs the number of players with a high IO that have failed mythics.
U take a risk judging either. No one wants to fail at their key. Is R IO really that much better…opinions aside…
I would like to know some facts on the matter.
Again please don’t be rude. I’m trying to maintain OPs guideline of a “clean debate” so to speak.
Honestly RIO isnt the issue, but the way people use it. Its just a tool and like every tool it can be misued. Now obviously people can make w/e group they want and if you get declined boo hoo move on. Tbh majority of the time you get declined its because
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youre not playing FOTM I.e. if you main a feral druid you need to realize outlaw rogues and dhs are a dime a dozen and people will take a 800 outlaw over a 1100 feral majority of the time
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you just dont fit the comp. For example if I have 2 ranged I’m not going to take a 3rd. Or we need an aoe stun
Not saying IO doesnt get misused. But dont blame the tool for not being used properly.
The addon doesn’t tell you to decline them though. It gives you a number. You can do whatever you want with that. I could decline you because you have a J in your name. Should we ban me seeing your name then since I am “discriminating” against it?
Most do though. Either that or they group with other people with similar experience. It isn’t a hard concept. When I am pushing keys I typically have 3 people premade. Makes things easier. However, when it is like 5 AM and I want to do a key, of course I am going to want people that aren’t experienced in the dungeon or affixes. Especially tanks/healers.
log onto raider io and link your characters together. It will just show mains prog instead. It isn’t a hard concept and why I was able to get into like +8s at 375.
Except that is slower. Why would you ever do that when you can just chain pull more. The Jockey’s themselves give enough % and the beginning trash is laughibly easy which is why quite a few routes aim for 40% before the first boss. Also, doing that strat this week is super troll since its fort AND bolstering so in order for your strat to AT ALL work it means you have to straight up single target the mech or it will end up with 2.5 million health from bolstering if you cleave. The alternative is stunning the jockey and AoEing since everything has similar health pools as opposed to the mech having over double the other mobs.
I mean 90% of the time it’s just because literally 20 DPS apply to every group and you can only take 3 at most.
You can be a good M+ class, you can have a ton of gear, and a good IO score and you’ll still get declined over and over because DPS is a saturated field. With the exception of Rogues in Tol Barad, even players well ahead of the curve are going to get rejected plenty of times if they’re pugging.
Which also allows group leaders to ask for massively inflated requirements. You don’t need 410ilvl and/or 1k IO to do a 10 Freehold, but when it takes about 2 minutes to get DPS even with those higher requirements, why would you ask for anything less?
There is no problem pointing out flaws in a system. My issue is Raider IO is treated as a full proof system.
This seems like a strawman argument. Nobody ever said it was without flaws. I don’t think anyone said it directly showed competence – merely that it showed experience, and experience tended to be more correlated with future success than gear potential.
Since there’s no objective data on failed runs, there’s no way to tell. Blizzard doesn’t provide that data, so all you have is personal experiences, and in the experiences of most people, they get way better results from using rio vs ilvl. Since rio is slightly less convenient to use than ilvl, people would switch back to ilvl if the results were either the same or worse than ilvl.
I don’t think i’ve seen anyone ever claim high rio was a guaranteed success. Merely that it was the best option we have and that experience is correlated with future success.
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