again, who is organizing this group? somebody has to, even in your queue scenario. what is the incentive for players who know what they’re doing to use it, when they could instead form a real group?
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Yes you vet players you don’t know and with zero knowledge of their skill of experience.
I don’t think you’ll get what you want out of this unless they just become LFR plus because without the Determination Buff and with no way to vet players beyond iLevel they’re going to be a crapfest.
Just look at LFR in the later parts of the week and how many stacks groups hit after the M+ and Raiders aren’t queueing to fish for Tier.
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Who’s going to set up markers for mechanics or set groups for split phases or for stacking etc?
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The system itself would handle the basic matchmaking by grouping players based on item level and roles. This simplifies the process and reduces the need for manual setup.
Heroic mechanics aren’t overly complex, though some bosses do require more coordination, like Raszageth and many of the other end-bosses. Automated groups might not clear the entire raid, but they could definitely make progress and down a few of the earlier bosses. Just like with traditional premade PUGs, not every group will get through the whole raid, but the queue system would provide a chance for players to experience raid content without the extra hassle of forming a group. The aim is to add accessibility, not replace the need for organized groups.
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Much like with LFR or dungeons, players could check before queuing whether they’re comfortable taking on roles like setting up markers or coordinating mechanics. Often, players are more than willing to step up and lead when given the opportunity.
The queue system wouldn’t remove the need for coordination; it would just make finding a group easier. Players who are experienced or willing to lead can still take charge and organize things like markers or split phases. This approach helps ensure that even in a more automated setup, there are still opportunities for players to contribute and guide the group, without the initial hassle of forming one from scratch.
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Yup. And when 25 of them get queued together and no one wants to lead, who will they blame then? Or when everyone leaves because no one is raid leading and they just yolo pulled and wiped? What then? Sit in the group avoiding deserter to refill and have it happen again?
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Without a way to gauge skill or experience beyond iLevel, there’s a risk that these groups might struggle, especially in the more challenging parts of Heroic content. It could end up resembling LFR in terms of performance.
The concern about groups becoming a “crapfest” is valid, especially if players are only joining to fish for gear and not focusing on progression. However, that’s where having some kind of system for tracking experience or offering incentives for players who lead or contribute effectively could help.
LFR struggles later in the week do show that even with automated systems, player quality can vary. But the hope is that a queue system for Normal and Heroic raids could still provide a more accessible way for players to experience raid content while also offering opportunities for those who want to step up and lead. It’s not a perfect solution, but it could be a step towards making raiding more accessible without completely replacing the need for organized, skilled groups.
These players have zero issue forming their own groups with the current LFG tool. They’re willing to step up and lead after all.
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again, wouldn’t those players just join or form a real group? why would they use a queue system that requires them to take the same responsibility but takes away their ability to choose players that help ensure success?
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The only content that is auto-filled is content that is not designed to be challenging. Normal and heroic are endgame activities. They should not be added to lfr options.
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you and i know perfectly well what will happen: they’ll be here on the forums calling the raid “overtuned” and “mathematically impossible” and screaming for nerfs 
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Oh, come on, Maximorben. Seriously? You think just because players can technically form their own groups with the current LFG tool means they’re all set? That’s like saying everyone should be a top chef just because they can cook a meal at home. It’s easy to say they’re “willing to step up and lead,” but in reality, the process of forming a raid group is often a complete mess.
Let’s be real: finding a group that’s not just a bunch of randoms who can’t agree on anything is like trying to herd cats. You have to deal with flaky players, those who drop out last minute, and the ever-present problem of people who don’t understand basic mechanics but still think they’re hot stuff. The current LFG tool isn’t exactly a shining beacon of efficiency; it’s more like a chaotic free-for-all where you cross your fingers and hope for the best.
A queue system might bring its own set of issues, but at least it could reduce the constant headache of organizing and vetting players. If someone’s going to complain about the idea without trying it, they’re basically just shouting from the sidelines. How about giving it a fair shot before assuming it’ll be just as bad as the LFG tool we already know is a trainwreck?
So whats the difference between using LFR and finding a raid group in premade raid finder and applying? Cause if youre going to say “raid leader can refuse you if you arent geared enough” well that already happens in LFR in the system ilvl restrictions.
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Just looking at your average LFR team should tell you why this would be impossible.
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and a random queue is somehow going to be better? because… reasons?
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It’s actually not. 8/8N because I started my own group. 3/8H because I started my own groups. It’s as easy as clicking the button that says start a group. Then you invite people based on your group needs and their experience. It’s all relatively straightforward and easy.
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Oh, Pyri, I see where you’re coming from, but let’s not kid ourselves. Those “willing to step up and lead” players are often the same ones who complain about the effort it takes to organize a group. If they’re so keen on leading, why aren’t they forming or joining premade groups all the time? The reality is, organizing a raid isn’t just about choosing the right players; it’s about dealing with the endless administrative headache of making sure everyone shows up, is on time, and actually knows what they’re doing.
The beauty of a queue system is that it takes away a lot of that hassle. You’re still going to have players who step up and lead, but they won’t have to spend half their playtime just trying to get a group together. Instead of wasting time managing logistics, they can focus on actually raiding. Plus, let’s be honest—sometimes players who are “willing to step up” are just as likely to cause problems as they are to solve them.
So yes, the queue system might not handpick every player with the precision of a raid leader selecting their dream team, but it’s an attempt to make raiding more accessible. It’s not about replacing the need for skilled players; it’s about offering a different path for those who want to get into content without the extra burden of group management. If players truly want a streamlined way to experience the game, they might actually find this approach more convenient and less of a logistical nightmare.
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Oh, Maximorben, I see you’ve cracked the code to perfect group management with your “click the button” strategy. Bravo! It’s impressive how you’ve turned raid-leading into a simple task akin to ordering a pizza.
But let’s get real for a second. Just because you’ve managed to get a few groups together doesn’t mean it’s a smooth ride for everyone. For every success story like yours, there are countless players who find the process anything but straightforward. If it were truly as easy as you make it sound, we wouldn’t be having this discussion about making raiding more accessible.
The reality is that starting a group isn’t just about pressing a button. It involves dealing with no-shows, players who think they’re ready but are clearly not, and the constant juggle of scheduling and coordinating. Sure, you’ve had success, but not everyone has the luxury of time or patience to navigate that chaos every time they want to raid.
A queue system wouldn’t be a magic bullet, but it could at least take some of the pain out of finding and organizing a group. It’s not about replacing the current system; it’s about providing an alternative for those who want to get into raiding without the administrative nightmare. So, while you’re out there effortlessly conquering content, some of us are just hoping for a little less hassle and a bit more accessibility.
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Oh, Pyri, as much as I’d love to live in a world where every raid group is a perfectly oiled machine, we both know that’s not the reality. Sure, the current LFG system can feel like trying to herd a particularly rebellious bunch of cats, but a random queue system isn’t some magical fix-all. It’s more like a different kind of organized chaos.
Think about it: a random queue system could at least standardize some aspects of the process. You’re not just randomly throwing people together and hoping for the best; you’re matching based on iLevel and roles, which means you’re getting a group that, at least theoretically, has a baseline level of preparedness. Yes, it’ll still come with its own set of challenges, but at least it’s an attempt to cut through the usual mess.
Instead of dealing with the endless trial and error of forming a group, you could be jumping straight into content with players who’ve met at least a minimum standard. It’s not a perfect solution, but it’s an alternative to the current system where getting a decent group can sometimes feel like winning the lottery.
So while it might not be a cure-all, it’s about offering players a chance to experience raiding without the usual headaches. If it turns out to be just another flavor of chaos, well, at least it’s a new kind of chaos to try out.
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That’s not how it works. Just because it’s an issue for you doesn’t mean it’s an issue for the game. This is a git gud situation through and through