No Rational Explanation For AV Win %

[Suraknar-deviate-delight]

Actually, I think there is a Rational Explanation.

Alliance just has forgotten how to win AV. People do whatever in the Battleground, keep making the same mistakes and repeat them every single game hoping for something different.

Actually, people are not even hoping for something different either. People have gotten used to play for Scraps.

“Lets cap a tower or two so at least we make some bonus honor”.

You suggest to people to go Right and they Go left.

You suggest to people to “take SF” and they ignore it.

“Hold SH”, they ignore it. When horde Takes SP Gy, before it caps, people spawning in teh cave are not even rushing SP they pass by trying to go to the south for who knows what while horde is contesting bunkers and Aid station in DB…

people contest Towers and GY’s and the leave em undefended. No but hello? Last 40 games that you did the same thing the GY and Towers got caped back. Why are you expecting different results by doing the same thing? Did you not learn that you may actually cap it if you stay there?

This is not how you play AV.

So the rational explanation is that the Majority of Alliance Players have gotten accustomed to be carried to Victory and do not know how to do it themselves.

It is very sad to see Alliance not knowing how to Win Av anymore and not even Trying to do something different or Improve even.

People are accustomed to play for the scraps. They queue Av expecting 1 Insignia and whatever Scrap bonus honor they can get.

I do not understand if this is because of Retail players playing Classic…has it gotten so effortless in retail?

In Classic you actually have to fight aggressively and hard, you have to bring your A-game in the battleground. Know your class, know your role in a fight.

[Ocisly-pagle]

because cheap shot and kidney shot sure the hell aren’t, right?

[Starya-bigglesworth]

ANY unfairness creates a cascading effect. horde should have NO advantege, period.

The ‘cascading effect’ is more to do with your player base. and the ‘investment’ your faction has – i.e. we are waiting one hour to play this game, you wait 1 minute.you tell me who is going to be more serious. This doesn’t account for other issues at play. But its not the starting location and anything else you come up with. It’s literally your faction losing.
If all forty of you stood and faced us…you could…and would win sometimes. But you don’t.

[Wickedtongue-heartseeker]

I have sat in many games about 100 and guess what? we only won two so stop being so god damn assholish. it is the map.

[Wickedtongue-heartseeker]

they should have launched the original from the gates

[Ocisly-pagle]

ANY unfairness creates a cascading effect. horde should have NO advantege, period.

The ‘cascading effect’ is more to do with your player base. and the ‘investment’ your faction has – i.e. we are waiting one hour to play this game, you wait 1 minute.you tell me who is going to be more serious. This doesn’t account for other issues at play. But its not the starting location and anything else you come up with. It’s literally your faction losing.
If all forty of you stood and faced us…you could…and would win sometimes. But you don’t.

you kiss you momma with that mouth?
the fact that the games are so horde favored is what makes half my team say “well, just afk then, fish at the pond, let them win, blablabla”

they don’t come into AV thinking to fish, they want to win, but its literally impossible
you’re not trying harder then us, come on, what a lame excuse is that.
all 40 of us DO stand and face you, EXCEPT ITS ALREADY ON OUR DEFENSIVE SIDE.
we kill you over and over, but it doesn’t matter because we’re already sitting at our graveyard, and you guys don’t lose an inch unless they made the death respawns 4 minutes, cause that’s how long it takes to kill you all and get to an actual objective.

[Cauchy-heartseeker]

Backdoor won’t happen every match if you keep 1-2 defenders there. It baffles me how alliance seem incapable of understanding that.

Defending isn’t part of the meta…

The aesthetics alone will attract different types of people.

For some folks, it’s the aesthetics. For the meta crowd, it’s the racials. There are even others who prefer to chose for back story. Huh… maybe there are lots of reasons why someone would choose the character they’re playing.

The best players on private servers went Alliance because Alliance racials are, for the most part, optimal for PVE performance.

The Alliance racials work quite well in PvP. They’re just overlooked because they’re not as passive as the orc’s stun resistance.

eally doubting my 5% spirit sword/mace

If you’re not using perception in PvP situations, you’re probably doing it wrong.

Dwarves and gnomes have great defensive cool downs, and night elves have a shadow meld, which means any class a night elf can be can stealth, which is amazing for PvP if used for ambushes.

No? Cause that zerg strat sure threw us for a loop the first couple weeks. until people quit fighting amongst ourselves and started working together.
It took more than forum posts. People repeatedly posting the strat in chat helped beat it into our savage brains.

Yeah, the Alliance are really proud of that strategy. So proud that they refuse to leave it, even though it just gets us stomped. For some reason, they think hiding behind the hill at SHGY still surprises horde.

I dont blame them for camping alliance. They get 1 match per 1-2 hours. Would you want it to be over in 20 mins and leave honor on the table?

Yeah, but some people only care about their max honor per hour. Don’t be silly, now!

If were fighting in our bunker…

We have lost already? What are you saying?

Dude… We have a huge advantage if we’re trying to defend our bunkers, and they have an advantage defending theirs. The reason why we get stomped if we’re left defending our bunkers is exactly that… WE ARE LEFT. No one wants to defend.

The Icewing choke point is not really any different than ours… it’s just that Alliance players are too thick to realize that defending should be part of a winning strategy.

When all of the Ally who are good at PvP/care about ranking are self-segregating themselves into their own groups that exclude the others, of course the people that are left in the PuG games are going to be a lot worse than average.

I’ve been beating this drum in a number of other threads. Alliance players just call me a leech and attack the level of this avatar (which I’m leaving at 59 for as long as I can…)

Then you are terrible. Horde use the backdoor every game. Not almost every game, not some games, but every game.

The back door is quite easy to defend. They have to do quite a bit of timed jumps to get up… a couple of ranged defenders could deter them, but again… defending isn’t part of “the meta.”

“All you have to do is defend”

The Horde actually defend their structures. This is how they win. We’re given some sound advice, but most folks are too thick to take it.

exploit the back door

This back door can be defended quite easily by a couple ranged players… but, it’s rarely defended.

[Ocisly-pagle]

If you’re not using perception in PvP situations, you’re probably doing it wrong.

Dwarves and gnomes have great defensive cool downs, and night elves have a shadow meld,

dude, way to answer everyone mostly wrong, but i was responding to a guy that said alliance racials are better for PVE, which just isn’t true either, perception doesn’t help me see ragnaros better.

[Traumaturge-grobbulus]

but i was responding to a guy that said alliance racials are better for PVE, which just isn’t true either, perception doesn’t help me see ragnaros better.

What a bizarre way to interpret what I said.

[Cauchy-heartseeker]

but i was responding to a guy that said alliance racials are better for PVE, which just isn’t true either, perception doesn’t help me see ragnaros better.

None of this was clear at all in your original comment. Not does it have anything to do with what I said.

[Celldweller-heartseeker]

If you’re not using perception in PvP situations, you’re probably doing it wrong.

Dwarves and gnomes have great defensive cool downs, and night elves have a shadow meld,

dude, way to answer everyone mostly wrong, but i was responding to a guy that said alliance racials are better for PVE, which just isn’t true either, perception doesn’t help me see ragnaros better.

Alright, now I know you’re either trolling or dumb.

[Zycci-whisperwind]

For some folks, it’s the aesthetics. For the meta crowd, it’s the racials. There are even others who prefer to chose for back story. Huh… maybe there are lots of reasons why someone would choose the character they’re playing.

Yeah, so why not just post on yours?

For some reason, they think hiding behind the hill at SHGY still surprises horde.

Nah, “they” just think it’s still a good way to get people to group up.

[Roddan-emerald-dream]

Because if i was still playing, for every counter you come up with, you can bet Id be think of ways to counter the counter. These bg’s are huge games of chess on steroids, if you guys do not up your strategy and leave the complaining of non exploits behind you, it will continue to be bad for you in pug vs pug scenarios.

You are missing the point. Of course there are counters and that’s why premades had a chance because we implemented them and overcame. It still doesn’t dismiss the fact that horde have an insane advantage at the beginning of the game(when early objectives are capped) where it matters the most.

[Gottemlol-illidan]

Qq filthy alliance worgen dogs!

[Cauchy-heartseeker]

Yeah, so why not just post on yours?

This is my main.

Nah, “they” just think it’s still a good way to get people to group up.

It’s “group up, wipe them at Bal.” Almost every time. We never seem to get past it. It’s not just a geography issue… it’s a strategy issue.

You are missing the point. Of course there are counters and that’s why premades had a chance because we implemented them and overcame. It still doesn’t dismiss the fact that horde have an insane advantage at the beginning of the game(when early objectives are capped) where it matters the most.

Early caps happen because the Alliance are do reluctant to defend. Folks think that because you’re not with the group, you’re automatically AFK. There have been multiple times where there were calls to report me as AFK while I was actively defending towers or our base (you could clearly tell if you were watching health bars in the raid interface.) I was also on my basic mount, so I couldn’t keep up with the group.

[Jadei-grobbulus]

I can’t tell if this is willful ignorance or not, but either way, I’ll play.

Your zerg wins because alliance almost always have some players trying to split off and go on offense while horde are zerging and their defense is weak. So 8 players split off trying to go on offense. 32v40 clash somewhere near Balinda. Horde wipe alliance based on numbers alone, but 15 horde die in the clash. They rez at IBGY. Guess where our 8 offensive players are just now arriving?

Horde can fully commit to offense. They do not have to split for defense because they know alliance cannot do anything offensively to require they defend. This happens for one reason. Horde reach SH at the same time alliance do.

So all this advice from horde who have one strat, zerg SH, to alliance who are shooting themselves in the foot if they commit 100% defense, just indicates to me that you’ve never had to practice what you preach.

This is just one possible scenario. There are many when horde have no threat to their backend while alliance do.

[Wunderland-grobbulus]

To have a losing % that is in the 90’s is nearly impossible. Not every Horde player is skilled, not every Alliance is a scrub, at some point the pug win % should be about 20-40%

Yet it’s not. That’s a sign that something more than “skill” is at player. The way the map starts now it puts Alliance on D unless you rush, there’s no way if you got two equally skilled H/A groups and pushed into each other’s bases would Alliance reach Drek before Horde reach van and down him.

IBGY is the best chokepoint in game, especially with IBT right there. You can cast from on top of the hill, Alliance cannot scale the hill nor wall cast you. Line of sight matters. Unlike Stormpike which anyone can climb on the hill, wall cast and rez with horde players sniping you with no defense. This simply doesn’t happen to the Horde at any of their GY’s.

[Omajingoro-deathwing]

I am sorry but simple thinking about your situation makes me realize YOUR TIMING IS WRONG. If you arrive and cap at the same time we are rezzing, FFS WAIT! lol

You guys have instant queues and can continually pvp, what does it matter if you spend a little extra time killing us or defending vs our zerg. I mean I understand you are competing against your own faction for ranking and the premades are making it difficult for you to keep up hph but how is it better to use bad strategy and lose, again and again going to help you?

If the timing of your first cap at IBGY does not work, then instead maybe do other things like cap sfgy, kill some lt’s at Galv or simply send a stealth scout to report the first wave of rezzers has rezzed and then move in for the cap. FFS, learn from what is happening during the battle and adapt appropriately, stop demanding the game be changed because it does not meet your expectations.

The definition of doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity. Holy cow, its rampant on alliance side, no wonder you are getting stomped over and over. You can not see any advantages in any of your situations and maybe could not comprehend how to exploit them even if you did. I really feel sorry for you guys.

[Jadei-grobbulus]

My point went completely over your head, but that happens when you’ve only played one side of the map.

[Omajingoro-deathwing]

Your strategies are a mess, if you are not in a capable group for your zerg rush, which alliance has dominated forever, perhaps you should cap sfgy before your offense starts moving forward. You have have completely stopped capping sfgy, likely cause of the conditioning of not capping it due to the Drek zergs.

Yet in this thread there are complaints that we can reinforce ibgy caps from our tunnel faster then you can reinforce from shgy. Again you are not capping or taking sfgy into the equation, surely it puts you closer to reinforcing and obviously the rezzers would not have to fight through our zerg at the shgy area.

So instead of doing the same things over and over that do not work, spend some extra time strategically taking objectives that will help you with your next objective. In this case, maybe wait till sfgy caps while your team voraciously defends shgy. I mean ffs, pull some lt’s from Galv to sfgy while you are waiting for it to cap.

I just dont get why you guys refuse or cant see alternative ways of doing things.