We actually don’t have enough details at this point to make any judgments. What you are assuming may be completely different from what ends up getting implemented.
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Personal loot is actually more loot in total and it is always useable (even if not always an upgrade). Removing trade restrictions based on item level would solve all legitimate complaints about personal loot.
Whether shady or not, raid leaders apparently just enjoy being in control. Not only can they kick you at any moment for any reason, but they can also refuse to include you when giving out gear.
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They are known, but are they really common?
It would be beneficial. It also only solves one of the 2 major problems of PL.
And it’s not just a minor skew. For my guild, we were 10x as likely to see the sylv ring as an edge of night.
That’s literally all you had to say.
Some people really want to be able to funnel loot. Asmongold does not try to hide this at all on his streams. He literally spent millions of gold to get carried on mythic N’zoth in 8.3.
He embraced whaling in Lost Ark.
He has a long history of whaling and paying to win. Even McConnel and Esfand are known for begging him to give them gold from his stream fanboys. It’s no secret.
The loudest advocates of Master Loot… are literally in it to funnel loot to themselves, their girlfriend, their whatever, they don’t want consensual loot distribution. They want a dictatorship. Absolute authority. That’s it. Make personal loot no restrictions and it becomes consensual and suddenly we can all play the game the way we should be playing it.
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That is not true at all.
How does removing trading restrictions solve artificial scarcity and drop rate discrepancy?
Caps, did you know we were both big time streamers??? news to me.
What I would theoretically propose is that the game implement a vote system before the leader can convert to ML. The vote would be anonymous, whether in a guild group or PUG, that’s all. No one would know who voted down ML.
Back when guild groups could choose loot mode, I personally knew players who preferred Personal but just went along with Master, even when in a group or guild they trusted.
Raid leaders could easily put it on ML without saying anything, or just say “we’re doing ML, OK?”, making it hard to speak up.
Raid leaders could kick you simply for speaking up or disagreeing.
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How does Master Loot solve artificial scarcity and drop rate discrepancy?
What on Earth are you talking about? I’m talking about personal loot and you start talking about gear acquisition philosophy. How is that relevant at all?
Let me explain:
The actual numbers for the ring vary with group comp, for my guild’s 1st sylv kill it worked out to just over 30% chance of seeing a ring.
Not philosophy, just math and probability.
What Asmongold said was that he wouldn’t have spent a dime of his own money. He took advantage of the pay 2 win aspects of Lost Ark because his fans threw money at it for him.
I’d probably just leave a guild at this point.
I dont wanna play with people who won’t just speak up.
wanting to hide a vote system sounds like those people can’t be trusted.
sounds like they just didn’t care either way.
that’s how the group lead works still with all things… they can just toggle settings. its still like that, and its not an issue.
what about this makes it hard to speak up.
then leave. And go look for people that are more your style.
is not understanding a thing grounds for it being irrelevant?
So your argument is that… raids should have WAY MORE dupes? Way more useless items that people can’t even equip? That’s literally why they switched to the current system. They didn’t want loot that nobody could use.
The rare chase items are there, and people can chase them. You can also still do this with personal loot no restrictions, you just won’t get nearly as many useless dupes that don’t have any value.
How does the drop rate of 1 item going from 30.5% down to 8.3% create more dupes?
I can tell you that I have recent experience of Disenchanting mythic raid rings from a boss we needed to kill for a weapon drop.
Your math doesn’t add up in the first place.
The drop rates and chase items are a thing and have been a thing for many years. You aren’t making a compelling argument for personal loot no restrictions. They would probably have to make changes so you couldn’t just run a raid with 8 rogues to get that rogue chase item on everyone in 2 or 3 months but again you built your castle on wet sand so it doesn’t really add up anyway.
Ok, where’s the error?
Right here. Never gets into the composition of the raid, the size of the raid or the actual drop rate of the items.
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The game’s very system would force the vote and hide the results. That is, every group would have to vote before ML could be physically turned on. (It wouldn’t be your guild or group deciding to vote, they would just have to vote.)
This is the only way to bring back ML that would be fair.
It’s an issue if the raid leader suddenly toggles to ML without your consent or without telling the group first.
In a large guild or group, I would argue that most people would not protest unless someone else spoke up first. Players that protest every last decision of the raid leader are more likely to get kicked.
There are 3 types of people on these forums when it comes to master loot. The people who want it because they benefit from it being abused. The people who don’t want it because they have been abused by the first type of person. And the third type of person who doesn’t care cause they either haven’t experienced abuse or they dont care about raiding in general.
Knowing this you can easily know what type of person is what in debates such as these.
I’m the one who’s against master loot.
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