It’s a pretty widely shared subjective opinion, if so. However I’ve taken the time to actually scorecard this out and I’m fairly confident in those assessments.
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The Army of the Black Moon has accomplished absolutely nothing on screen and haven’t even been shown to exist past the constant back and forth that is the Warfront.
No I’m not willing to trade Teldrassil for more empty content that I’m told exists but I can’t actually interact with in any meaningful way in game.
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We can just assume that the army of the black moon died out in the Darkshore Warfront, and therefore we didn’t have any Night Elves left to attack Ashenvale, thus the Horde kept it.
They also don’t have to deal with the Night Elves’ still having black eyes if they’re dead.
I don’t think you can go that far with the assumption. It’s more reasonable to assume that the same thing happened to the Army of the Black Moon that happened to the Vindicaar or Draenei, Worgen, that group of Gnomes, or any other detail left out of the War of Thorns that would have added credibility to the true fact that the Horde wouldn’t be able to just run rough shod over the Night Elves.
They aren’t convenient and the thought of having to take them into account makes the writers throw a hissy fit so they just ignore and pretend they no longer exist.
The only one that’s gotten an explanation is the Vindicaar because of Blizzcon and they’re response was “Oh it’s out of gas.”
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Eh It wouldn’t be far fetched to assume their death. Since that’s all Night Elves do nowadays. Die. And then die again in the maw when their souls are destroyed.
This way they can never appear again and the Horde can happily keep Ashenvale and celebrate their victory over Kalimdor.
Let me be clear that if Danuser made a throw away tweet today saying that the Army of the Black Moon tried to retake Ashenvale and they all died? I would not be surprised in the slightest. But until then the Army of the Black Moon is just a detail that they don’t want to deal with anymore so they ignore it’s there.
I don’t doubt for a moment that it’ll come out that the Horde still holds Ashenvale and because Tyrande has given up on justice and holding the Horde accountable she’s just gonna let them have it like she did Azshara when Varian told her to.
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I feel that I should push back on this a bit.
You are likely all aware that my position is that pessimism about the future of the Night Elves’ content is a stance based in data, whereas most optimism is not. I have been watching this company operate for some time in this manner, there’s not much that they’ve done in BFA/Shadowlands that they didn’t do in Cata/MOP - and so we can us that to make predictions.
Recent sentiments do not fall within the data that we have.
No we can’t. As inadequate, ham-handed, and unsatisfying as Darkshore was, the Army of the Black Moon was still victorious there according to a developer interview and a heavily unpolished, tardily released cinematic.
As mean-spirited, proud of themselves, and constantly induced to antagonize Night Elf players as Blizzard are (see my other thread), and as much as core segments of their playerbase are right along with them (see that same other thread), this wouldn’t be consistent with their history. Twitter is normally where they shove the Night Elves’ victories (or statements about possible victories) - and where they try to do some damage control. I haven’t seen them use it as a vehicle to hand them military defeats.
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Sad…
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Like who? Which are those ‘‘most’’ race you are talking about??? Aside from human and orc, which race really had more onscreen feel good moment??? Maybe people would take you seriously if you didn’t pretend that most race had it better than night elf…
Gnome only ‘‘feel good’’ moment is their leader beating Galliwix.
Worgen only ‘‘feel good’’ moment is Genn breaking the lentern.
Dwarf didn’t even had one.
Darkspear only ‘‘feel good’’ moment was Vol’jin in the end of Soo cinematic and he got kill barely two years after.
Tauren didn’t event had one.
Blood elf get a few OUTSCREEN development moment but didn’t had one real onscreen feelgood moment.
Forsaken had nothing outside of Sylvanas in the Bfa expansion cinematic…
And here you are pretending that all that is better than Darkshore cinematic, nightwarrior ritual and Tyrande killing nathanos… I am not saying that any of those is sufficient, but it is clearly more that ‘‘most’’ race had…
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Terror of Darkshore was definitely a “feel good moment”, i mean, the story of the cinema is litteraly “Omg…they…coming…back…we …we have…WE HAVE A BIG PROBLEM!”
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yup. Definitively was. Part of the problem i think is coming from the pessimist attitude toward those moment. I remember after that cinematic, many night elf poster ( not the majority) were saying that is was useless because we would never know who won the warfront because of gameplay reason. Turn out that the night elf did won it but the only think that people remember is that feeling that it wasn’t going to be a victory.
Same with Tyrande cinematic. Remember how that epic feel good moment was bring down because ‘’ Nathanos is just going to go to Sylvanas’’. Well we still haven’t see him at all but night elf player won’t retroactively see it as a feel good moment.
And as i said, those few moment doesn’t make it up for Teldrassil. But claiming that ‘‘most other race’’ had more feel good moment is just absurd.
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Part of the problem is, that the Moments thereafter never be good, everytime twisted.
But they weren’t. Night elf did get to beat the horde in darkshore. Tyrande did kill Nathanos for good. Those ‘‘not good moment’’ that you are talking about didn’t happened. It just happened here on the forum created by those doomsayer. The only one not that great after moment was the fight in Darshore who wasn’t a win for Nathanos either and was far as equal as people make it look. Tyrande and Malfurion did get to overpowered Nathanos, the two night elf undead and mostly, two val’kyr empowered by the maw. Not killing all of them doesn’t mean being nearly equal.
Lenastus, stop, no, to say that the victories here was “clear and unambiguous”…are simply statements that I can not take seriously. Imagine no one had asked at Blizzcon…what would have been then, hrmm?
To call that a feel good moment is…whew, I don’t know, actually bs.
Then to Nathanos, Nathanos shouldn’t have survived Darkshore in the first place, and that’s not a statement that has to do with his death in his Cinema, because honestly, it doesn’t bother me that he still brought mocking statements, but he shouldn’t have been allowed to survive there at all if Blizz had understood just a hint of plain story telling.
If you plan on creating a divine avatar and hyping it like Blizz intended, it doesn’t take two characters to take down an undead archer. and thats the point…if you want to build up something, then you have to show IT, not to TELL it.
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Off screen, and then we were just randomly told that we won in the Shadowlands pre patch. Also, getting 1 out of 3 zones back is a joke, was there a zone imbalance so that they had to give the Horde Ashenvale or what? I thought that was resolved in cata.
It’s not for good when he makes his return in the maw, and even said that he would.
That brings the total Horde members brought to justice to… 0.
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I don’t care about what you take seriously because this is what happened. Like this is the canon and this is what it was meant for. Your on moment feeling that you think you are going to lose doesn’t mean anything in a scenario that you did win.
In fact you haven’t any material be it in game, in book or anything showing that the night elf didn’t had a clear victory from the cinematic and following it… The cinematic is pretty clear that the night elf are here to beat the horde and since only the alliance version of the warfront is canon, the night elf victory in that warfront is clear. Than you also have difference source stating that the night elf did retake darkshore.
Your pessimist feeling about it doesn’t erase the canon victory.
The night elf warfront is IN GAME and both the hd cinematic and that crappy cinematic of the victory are IN GAME.
Isn’t the maw a bad place to have his soul in? Considering that he is still non-existent in the patch where Sylvanas is a raid boss and considering that the expansion is looking as a only X.2 patch expansion, Nathanos is gone for real.
The Darkshore warfront doesn’t resemble the Night Elves winning, it’s a back and forth.
Isn’t about the Night Elves winning.
In which we are told that we won, but we never got to actually win against the Horde onscreen.
Uh not really, I think Sylvanas is having a pretty good time there.
I’ll believe it when I see it, until that Nathanos just magically gets redeemed along with Sylvanas, as both Nathanos and Ion stated.
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It isn’t. There is just two version of the warfront. One is canon and is real with the other one not being real and existing just for the horde to experience the warfront. The night elf warfront IS canon.
But you did on your version, the real version, of the warfront.
No its about the night elf being ready to do.
So basically, you have one hd cinematic showing you being ready to fight back with a gread hype moment, a whole warfront showing how you did beat the horde and win the battle and one crappy cinematic just to be sure that everyone knew that the night elf won… Following by many material source saying that night elf did retake darkshore…
If this isn’t a win for you then nothing will ever be because that is 100% a win on nearly every point.
Uh no, we don’t know that. Both of those can realistically happen… even multiple times.
Nothing speaks against that.
And then the Horde beat the Night Elves again… and it kept going on like this.
And it’s also about the Horde being ready to do:
See above.
And also showing the Horde beating the Night Elves.
And yet, we didn’t win onscreen.
Furthermore, I’ll still not be happy with a Darkshore that’s inaccessible and destroyed for half the time, and an Ashenvale that is currently in the process of getting destroyed and blighted by the Horde.
And I’ll also not be happy as long as the Night Elves are nearly extinct with no future and nowhere to go.
Wrong. We know it as it have been said that the night elf version was the canon one.
Stop it. It didn’t happen as it isn’t canon. Your headcanon doesn’t change it.
You know that your whole argument is about something that dev already state as not being canon??? That your entire argument is about something that NEVER happened?