Night Elves and Forsaken don't need new cities

[Ninh-draka (Ninh)]

@Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood

Since the Silver Hand has overtly supported the Alliance since BfA, I’d have them officially rejoin the Alliance as a restored Kingdom of Lordaeron with its capital either at Stratholme or Andorhal.

Stratholme would be the more important literary point for a human nation, what with it being the proverbial start of the nations fall. That would however mean that both the Forsaken and Blood Elves would be keen to remove said nation as a threat what with it presenting a clear block on their borders by the Alliance.

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

@Akiyass-moon-guard

Yet you are still not over losing Lordaeron nearly 20 years ago

What are you talking about? Lordaeron’s fall was great. It was really cool and filled with pathos. It was probably the high water mark for the human narrative in all of Warcraft.

That’s why I want humanity’s Lordaeron-centric heritage to be more widely acknowledged. That really interesting event should play a prominent part in the fabric of human culture even if it doesn’t translate to land gains.

[Shernish-nazjatar]

Oops … Me need to tell people in advance what kind of deal I’m proposing. My deal is to offer a man without an arm to sew on a hand, in exchange for his other hand. Or a leg. Kidneys. Eyes. In general, he will not like it.

[Erevien-aegwynn]

Lordaeron has always belonged to the Forsaken ever since classic. Stop supporting the crazy dwarf in his Lordaeron campaign.

@Zahirwrite-farstriders

Characters i can totaly understand…really, but…Lands?

ever since TBC Blizzard was on their mission to kill Hrode and former Horde characters. and it left us with people nobodylikes or wants. Like Calias and Rokhan and Voss.

[Zahirwrite-farstriders]

@Lenastus-zuljin

Like for real??? Who have been arguing for years defending everything about the alliance!!!

yeah…pls show me If you can´t (because its never happened)…then simply…shut up.

@Erevien-aegwynn

ever since TBC Blizzard was on their mission to kill Hrode and former Horde characters. and it left us with people nobodylikes or wants. Like Calias and Rokhan and Voss.

…WHAT? I said “Yes i Agree, i get it, Characters is totaly understandable…but lands”

and you:

“Characters bla bla” …

Are you actually reading?

[Erevien-aegwynn]

So you support bringing all the dead characters back then yes?

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

@Shernish-nazjatar

Oops … You need to tell people in advance what kind of deal I’m proposing. My deal is to offer a man without an arm to sew on a hand, in exchange for his other hand. Or a leg. Kidneys. Eyes. In general, he will not like it.

You mean what would I give up in exchange? Give up to who, the Horde or to some kind of PvE enemy?

Does the Alliance even have anything that the Horde wants at this point? The Horde has conquered pretty much all the Alliance lands they desire.

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

@Ninh-draka

Stratholme would be the more important literary point for a human nation, what with it being the proverbial start of the nations fall. That would however mean that both the Forsaken and Blood Elves would be keen to remove said nation as a threat what with it presenting a clear block on their borders by the Alliance.

Maybe, but maybe they should have to learn to deal with the Alliance living in close proximity to them as part of their post-BfA rehabilitation where the goal is presumably to have them behave better.

[Zahirwrite-farstriders]

@Erevien-aegwynn

So you support bringing all the dead characters back then yes?

no, i don´t…but i get it, that horde lost many chars over time.

[Solarion-wyrmrest-accord]

@Lenastus-zuljin

I disagree here. While its true that not all forsaken are from Lordaeron, far from that, the playable forsaken is from Lordaeron. Add to that the fact that retaking Lordaeron is kind of the first thing that the forsaken did as a group and as for now, Lordaeron have been the main city for most of the forsaken since being forsaken was a thing and not only for Lordaeron forsaken.

While i agree that the forsaken need to go forward, that shouldn’t automatically mean to delete what they were. With the state of the game, the amount of people that have left and how far we are in the game, they can’t just erase a so much big part of the identity of a core race and expect enough people to go on with a new one.

I don’t disagree that the Forsaken’s history is solidly rooted in Lordaeron. That said, they’ve been thoroughly uprooted from Lordaeron thanks to Sylvanas. The Forsaken literally cannot return to their home. Undercity is uninhabitable even to them. What’s left is a land directly bordering new/rebuilt Alliance strongholds such as Stromgarde, Gilneas, and Aerie Peak. Their closest allies, the Blood Elves, are significantly further away, and don’t even have their own lands fully controlled yet.

Something I liked about BFA was Thomas Zelling. We saw a Kul Tiran human become one of the Forsaken, and they provided a very humanizing element to the Forsaken as well. It did a lot to help move the narrative past this, “The Forsaken are the Scourge 2.0,” hole it had been mired in. Well, until he was killed.

That said, seeing the Forsaken bringing in undead from other nations opens up quite a bit of new narratives.

So, while I’ll always say, “listen to actual Forsaken fans over me,” I will say my opinion is that the Forsaken shouldn’t continue to cling to the identity of Lordaeron when their ranks are expanding through the undead of other nations. Don’t forget their roots, but move past the, ‘Scourge 2.0,’ identity that’s become almost synonymous with Undead Lordaeron.

[Shernish-nazjatar]

Surrender to the Horde. You are “buying” Lordaeron from the Horde.
The Horde wants Ashenvale. But that would be a deal with the night elves.

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

@Solarion-wyrmrest-accord

So, while I’ll always say, “listen to actual Forsaken fans over me,”

I wish people would be similarly mature and considerate when it comes to speculating on human identity.

[Akiyass-moon-guard (Akiyass)]

@Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood

humanity’s Lordaeron-centric heritage to be more widely acknowledged.

It is… they are called The Forsaken

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

I think that the mere fact that Lordaeron is desirable for human fans and Stormwind is desirable for literally nobody to the point where even if I offered it to the Horde in exchange for something they would decline it says a whole lot.

[Ninh-draka (Ninh)]

@Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood

Maybe, but maybe they should have to learn to deal with the Alliance living in close proximity to them as part of their post-BfA rehabilitation where the goal is presumably to have them behave better.

Power politics in the real world have easily shown that nations don’t do that when they feel surrounded. We’d just be back into the WoW status quo of Cold War.

EDIT: Any restored Kingdom of Lordaeron would likely have to be a neutral nation realistically, likely with Calia considering it would fit into her entire character schtick (or her daughter if she were found alive).

[Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood (Ainhin)]

@Shernish-nazjatar

Surrender to the Horde. You are “buying” Lordaeron from the Horde.
The Horde wants Ashenvale. But that would be a deal with the night elves.

That’s just it though. I can’t bargain with the Horde in this regard because the Alliance doesn’t have anything valuable left to give the Horde. The Horde has all the valuable stuff already and hence have no reason to negotiate on anything.

[Dreadmoore-wyrmrest-accord (Dreadmoore)]

@Zahirwrite-farstriders

Which lands? Most of the Lands the horde “lost” were taken from the alliance

We had less land in vanilla than the alliance. we were owed land for parity.
You know this, you’re just obscenely greedy.

@Zahirwrite-farstriders

Show me pls the post in which one i defend the alliance

Man your memory’s bad.

Pride in Defeat - Teldrassil and Theme

The War of the Thorns broke my love for the Horde, I think forever. There are no words I have left for the faction (lorewise) and I’m not even talking about hypocrisy yet. The Horde deserves to be wiped out for its blind followers - for the third time - as a faction, now not the citizens of the Horde. But that is not going to happen, so I can only express my opposition by saying that I simply do not want to play the Horde anymore. no…i felt no pride for Teldrassil and will never feel pride fo…

[Solarion-wyrmrest-accord]

@Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood

I wish people would be similarly mature and considerate when it comes to speculating on human identity.

To be fair, Lordaeron certainly seems lost as part of the human identity.

For one thing, Calia Menethil is an undead and among the Forsaken. I know there aren’t many Forsaken fans thrilled by this, but if anyone has a claim to Lordaeron in any capacity, it’s Calia Menethil. She might refuse to be acknowledged as it’s Queen, but that doesn’t lend any less clout to a group, ‘claiming,’ Lordaeron.

For another, the one living human left with a strong claim to Lordaeron (not strong enough to over-ride Calia’s mind you) is Turalyon, who himself comes off as more Draenei than human more often than not. It’s not a twist to his character I particularly like either, but it is what it is.

As far as humans and Lordaeron go, I’m open to seeing a, ‘New Lordaeron,’ founded in the future by some remnants of the original kingdom, but the fact remains much of the lands of Lordaeron have been blighted, and are as inaccessible to living humans as undead ones.

[Akiyass-moon-guard (Akiyass)]

@Ainhin-thorium-brotherhood

that Lordaeron is desirable for human fans

I mean, you think that but… Go to any RP server, Alliance side. Everyone RPs in Stormwind, when Boralus is a far better and more immersive human city. Most Horde players want Lordaeron because it is generally accepted the Forsaken are the Afflicted people of Lordaeron.

Alliance players would just mark it as a win and let it be a Ghost town like they did with Dalaran, Stromgard, Gilneas and Boralus.

[Lenastus-zuljin (Lenastus)]

@Zahirwrite-farstriders

yeah…pls show me If you can´t (because its never happened)…then simply…shut up.

Since i have no time to look into your 4k post and since you have no self awareness and just prefer to be toxic, let just make it simple.

Do you agree that the night elf were at wrong in the blood elf zone.
Do you agree that the genocide of Dalaran was not justify.
Do you agree that the alliance are at wrong for attacking Sylvanas out of nowhere in Stormheim?