I mean, that’s how it’s been since Teldrassil; I’m not seeing any reason to believe things will start to change in any way. Blizzard, if nothing else, is consistent on most fronts; unfortunate that it’s mediocrity/failing to follow through that they’re consistent with in this case.
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That’s racist.
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- This is true.
- He is wrong for calling for peace without ensuring that the Horde won’t for a third time try to wipe out the alliance in the past five years. Like seriously he is delusional to think the horde is going to sit down and sing songs by the campfire with him.
- If the Horde doesn’t leave Kaldorei lands, then they will pay price in full with blood.
- This is mostly, we are tired of captain boy scout anduin and that his ideals is beyond reproach. Too often when Alliance members call for vengeance anduin turns them into lawful stupid or they die.
- We are nervous she is becoming an anduin yes man
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Well not really what I meant, but yes I agree with that too, I think there’s certainly a line between being passionate and unhealthily invested. At a certain point, it’s probably best to just pull the plug and find other things worth enjoying if it becomes too much of a source of frustration here.
Still a lesson I’m learning though, so I may not be the best one to give that advice.
This stuff cracks me up.
So. Tell me. Were the Night Elves genocided, pounded into the ground, routed, and destroyed, as you guys constantly cry about?
Or are Night Elves this powerful military empire that is singlehandedly going to continue - and win! - a world war?
Yall gotta figure this one out before you come to play, seriously, because the cognitive dissonance is really goofy.
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See, the thing is, these two items are actually directly linked. What would be “justice” to these people? The common answer would be…
In the face of Sylvanas commanding the Horde to do what it did, nothing was ever going to be “justice” to them. Sylvanas, the chief orchestrator of Teldrassil’s destruction, being the most wanted on Azeroth and despised by all wasn’t enough. The bare minimum of what would satisfy the calls for justice would’ve been trying all parties involved in the War of Thorns Horde side as war criminals and mass executing or imprisoning them… despite the majority of them having also sided against Sylvanas.
There are few circumstances when this happens in real life, usually not when both sides call a truce. And considering that would’ve involved offing the Horde player characters, it would’ve been utterly unfeasible in a gameplay sense too. The retribution that the people in question have been calling for is impossible… It was ALWAYS impossible.
The characterization of this being like Blizzard tossing out a dog treat and saying its a ten course meal is inaccurate. I’d say its more like what they were able to give is considered a dog treat to people who have been craving a ten course meal, but had no real promise (or realistic expectation) of one. Hell, its obvious from Tyrande’s lines that this isn’t the final say of it from Blizzard but you get people acting like it is.
Having players who care about the story is good. Having them care so much about the story that they take the dramatic beats and turns of it personally and want to inflict that onto the other side of the fanbase or burn the setting to the ground… less so.
I’m a Forsaken player that had their hopes that Sylvanas would turn out to be good (if anti-heroic) in the end thoroughly dashed and stomped on well before this expansion, had their faction villain batted against my desires again, with more and more of their faction’s characters being killed off or turning traitor. But I’m not acting like Blizzard killed my dog, and then backed out of their promise to give me my neighbor’s puppy as compensation.
And now there’s a clear understanding that if WoW tries to go anywhere near GoT standards, there’ll be vitriolic backlash from a portion of the fanbase unless they sate the mobs with exactly what they may or may not have promised.
Don’t pretend that if Blizzard straight up told their Night Elf players this that the same people complaining about it now wouldn’t step up their activity tenfold. You absolutely know that it would not be fine for them.
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I’ve suffered from fatigue from overexposure to tons of people complaining about the New Trilogy, believe me.
I’ve not seen anything resembling this stuff in SWTOR, when both factions got absolutely crushed in the third expansion. But then, I’ll admit, I’ve kept myself isolated from story forums, so I’ve only my social circles in that game to go off of.
Two things can be true at once.
Night Elves suffered a genocide and have been depopulated down to a refugee status, with their civilian populace more or less decimated to a point where it will take some considerable time for them to rebuild and heal.
Night Elves still have an active military force that’s at least strong enough to gain steady territory in key locations like Darkshore. After all, most of their military forces were routed away and busy in Silithus, which is why the Horde had the upper hand in Darkshore at the beginning of this war.
And to be quite frank, I don’t think I’ve ever seen you or others here hold the same standards to, say, the Blood Elves, who were in a similarly decimated position as the Night Elves. No, I’m sure you and other Horde partisans encouraged them to continue fighting with gritted teeth and gain the vengeance they were seeking against those who wronged them as well, regardless of how badly a position they were in. Because any one of us finds that more admirable than just sitting down and taking the punishment given.
So no, I think Night Elf fans are well in their right to wish for retribution despite what bad position their preferred race might be in the story. Even if they can’t win, it’s more admirable to keep fighting than to give up like a weakling.
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Part of the thing with night elves is that this isn’t the first time they’ve been the punching bag. Cata saw a lot of their lands invaded by the horde, and in Wolfheart Varian had to go wolf super saiyan to save them from orcs In Cata there was no actual conclusion to the Ashenvale stuff. Night elves have never really…gained anything in the game outside of a small camp in the Wetlands i guess? Moonglade and Hyjal were turned into neutral zones for gameplay purposes.
Compare this to the Forsaken. Yes, the forsaken lost their capital too. But these two losses are not exactly the same.
A. The undead lost their city on their own terms, blowing it up and evacuating while taking out many alliance soldiers, where as Teldrassil was not entirely evacuated and was burned by the Horde.
B. The Forsaken have had more victories over the years, expanding their lore and having several big victories in Cataclysm. Winning Andorhol, taking over Hillsbrad, effectively making GIlneas a no man’s land etc. For the night elves this is just the biggest loss in a string of blows against their race, for the undead this is their first real kick in the balls with any staying power since Cata.
C. The night elves not only lost their first starting zone entirely outside of bronze dragon time travel but ALSO had their second starting zone Darkshore turned into a warfront that will forever be in a state of Winterguard esque tug of war between the factions. It seems that whenever it’s time to take away from the night elves it’s good to put it in game, but when it comes to the night elves potentially gaining something like basing themselves in Hyjal, there’s no time to show that in game. Arathi is a warfront too sure but it was always a contested zone.
On the surface sure you can say ‘both races lost a city’ but when you look at the greater context of things, it’s easy to see why night elves are more frustrated than undead players at the state of things.
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I’ll grant that I’m probably not as invested as I’ve been previously since hopping between other MMOs. Like, I no longer identify as a Horde player, I identify as an Azerothian player at best.
Sometimes two things can be true at once.
“our entire population has been slaughtered nearly to extinction” and “we are mighty and will win a world war!” are not two things that can be true at the same time. One has to be false. They are literally mutually exclusive.
Now if we were talking something vastly smaller-scale, like “we will consolidate our remaining population and take this one nub of territory!” then, okay sure, that’s doable.
But this goofy revanchist nonsense is just that - goofy revanchist nonsense. You can’t be victim and victor at the same time.
Either we have a witheringly small population of Night Elves who, on a quest for vengeance are just going to end up getting even more Night Elves killed - this is the likeliest situation we’re dealing with, to be fair
OR
Night elves didn’t suffer jack squat because apparently they have the ability to continue a war they have clearly already lost - and win, somehow!
To be quite Jeff, you haven’t looked, either:
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Imo tyrande was the absolute worse written character in the game. She always wants vengeance for pretty much any transgression no matter how minor and never sees her own fault in any scenario she finds herself in, then something legitimately worthy of a crusade of vengeance happens and she is too Petty be present at org when the siege happens. Her character has absolutely no development she goes from Petty and vengeful to Petty vengeful and edgy.
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Don’t forget that Night Elf players also exist in a state of anticipation and dread as all the shoes have yet to drop.
This Night Elf story arch that we’ve been on since the pre-patch only ends one way: the leader of the Night Elves deciding to let go and move on.
That may be Tyrande letting go of the Night Warrior or Shandris lamenting, “Mother. Why wouldn’t you listen?” I don’t know.
The Alliance - of which the Night Elves are nominally part of - is all about forgiveness and stuff and, more importantly, Blizzard has already dragged this out. Prolonging the Night Elf narrative long enough for a reasonable and satisfying, if not happy, conclusion seems very unlikely.
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How many transgressions has she been through?
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There was the time me and some friends organized a pet battle in her temple-thing, and just had bunnies kill each other for a while in the sacred waters.
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Who cares? Like seriously who at this point cares? She wants vengeance that’s been her whole thing for the last 20 some odd years at this point it’s old progress the story or kill off the character
This isn’t just exaggerating, it’s completely false.
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I have to agree.
Tyrande’s character for the last 20 years has been wearing a flimsy dress and simpering over Malfurion.
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The thing is, you are both right and wrong here. You are completely misrepresenting the character, but to your credit, Blizzard has been getting her wrong since everything after WC3. She is the most disservice character in the game… Hell, Mekkatorgue has had more feel-good moments than her and He is a GNOME… The leader of the race that is destined to forever be just once big comic relief. (Not gnome hate, but it’s true sadly).
You are also bias… Whenever Night Elves are brought up you fly off the handle.
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Sylvanas steps into the beam of light, and her undead red eyes are suddenly changed to gold. Fiery, golden wings burst from her back, and her armor is changed to take on a more divine appearance. Her hand trembles as she picks up the Ashbringer in one hand and the Doomhammer in the other. Somehow, both weapons found her worthy, and they burned with a power unlike ever seen before. Tyrande, awed, hangs her head in shame and turns, looking over to Anduin. “You were right… My King,” she says, kneeling. “She was the one to save us all, all along… Had I allowed my vengeance to overtake my heart, I would have doomed Azeroth.” Anduin places an understanding hand on Tyrande’s shoulder. “It’s alright, Tyrande,” he says, smiling, his expression indicating that all is forgiven. Then, Sylvanas approaches from behind them, and Tyrande rises, head still hanging in shame. “You were correct, Sylvanas,” said Tyrande. “If not for the souls of Teldrassil… The Void Lords would have had their way with our world.” Sylvans nods. “You are forgiven, Tyrande,” says Sylvanas, putting a hand on the Night Elf’s cheek tenderly. Then, suddenly, the dark leaves Tyrande’s eyes as the Night Warrior’s cursed hold on her is broken. “The false goddess Elune can harm you no longer,” says Sylvanas. “Be one with the Light.” Tyrande, her eyes radiating a pure golden light, raises her head proud and nods. “For the Light,” says the former Priestess of the Moon. “For the Light,” says High King Anduin, lord of the combined Alliance and Horde coalition. Sylvanas then turns to face the coming Void Armada, and raises the Ashbringer high. “For Azeroth!” she cries.
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