At this point in terms of atonement, we’ll need to see what Blizzard actually has the Horde do. There should be at least something to address the occupation of night elf lands, move that story forward even if it’s not reflected in game. If the Horde doesn’t give back those lands in some capacity, then… well, it would be even worse than MoP.
It would mean that the Horde actually comes out on top and better than before, and will have lost nothing. Because, as per the lore we have now, Sylvanas never actually cared for the Horde and was using them as sacrifices for her own gain. Combined with Thrall coming back, and the addition of the allied races and their lands, the Horde is stronger than ever. Especially when they break out the Blight-killing Macguffin we all know they have up their sleeve and cleanse Undercity.
Really, with this story Blizzard’s kind of forced themselves to do a world revamp in some form.
A part of me will always wonder if this would have happened had I acted sooner. If I had confronted Sylvanas in the early days of the war. If Teldrassil hadn’t burned.
It is not an easy thing to watch a dear friend tread a dark path, to recognize when they have gone astray. I thought I knew her, and Saurfang has paid the price for my error in judgment.
Does it seem ambiguous which way Lor’themar feels about the burning of Teldrassil? Or any of his earlier comments?
I cannot fault Baine’s heart, even if his actions were drastic. Through this act of defiance, he exposed a schism in the Horde that has been growing since the attack on Teldrassil.
I fear that by openly opposing, he may have put his own peopleat risk. As mine would be, were I to side with him.
These are perilous times. We must be cautious… and deliberate.
Even when he is remembering her life of service, he does so in the same breath as mentioning his disagreements with her, even though the quotes above would indicate that he realizes quickly after that his respect for her in life impaired his judgment of her in the present day.
I’ve had my share of disagreements with Sylvanas… But I will never forget her sacrifice. She was the Ranger-General of Silvermoon. Nothing will ever change that.
Oh heck yeah it is ambiguous “if Teldrassil hadn’t burned”
What is that even suppose to mean? What does he mean by “if”?
If what?
“Schism in the horde” really? REALLY? That is the dialogue that is supposed to address why the great honourable Horde would deliberately participate in a mass killing?
Besides Baine acted because Sylvanas had done the thing to Derek it had nothing to do with Horde’s latest mass slaughter.
“If Teldrassil hasn’t burned.” As in, in following with the two sentences directly before this, “If I had confronted Sylvanas early in the war and stopped Teldrassil from burning.”
If you’re confused about what the last part of that paragraph means, remember that the first two sentences are all about adding context.
…This feels like a non-sequitur, being honest. Lor’themar’s quote there was to address his feelings on Teldrassil going far back, and the rest of his quote talking about needing to be deliberate indicates very early on which side of that “schism” he’s on.
Again, rather non-sequitur-ish, now we’re going on about Baine’s Derek action as though he was chill with his faction mass-murdering a Night Elven capital.
And its only true if we assume that Derek’s circumstances exist in a vacuum from Teldrassil, which it doesn’t (because nothing exists in a vacuum). Baine’s explanation when prompted by Jaina very obviously indicates that he didn’t act on Derek’s injustice alone, but on the “sickness” in the Horde.
Lor’themar’s quote also serves to tie Teldrassil to the current events as well, if you think about it.
The Night Elf druids did sleep but they also fought the legion a second time and minions of C’thun. The Sin’dorei didn’t fight to save the world, they really didn’t care about the first or second war. They fought the Troll’s who’s land they stole. If any of the then Quel’dorei fought to save the world it was Alleria and the tiny force of Farstriders that Anasterian provided the Alliance. Liadrin outright lied.
I like Liadrin… but that was a doozy of a line. I mean, Wc3 they destroyed their world tree to kill archemonde and defeat the legion all the while giving up their immortality as the price to be paid.
I mean you could argue that the Kaldorei only acted because they had to. They seemed completely pleased to let the entire world die as long as Ashenvale was okay.
As wow has progressed it’s been proven that the Kaldorei actually care about the outside world beyond ashenvale though. They have been more than willing to assist the alliance whenever and without question… why everyone still calls them xenophobic hate ful racists is beyond me.
Because we haven’t been apart of any alliance and Kalimdor was mostly unknown to the outside world, Ashenvale and the wilds have kind of been their charge.
Part of it might be whenever Blizzard needs someone on the alliance to hold the idiot ball, the Night Elves are a top pick, not to mentions ones like Staghelm or, if you go back far enough, the Highborn that turned against Azshara were indeed bigoted, Jerod was the right commander in the War of the Ancients, his predecessors however…
I mean that’s exactly it. They only cared about Ashenvale until the Legion returned. They were fine with letting demons and orcs attack Azeroth, until those demons and orcs attacked Ashenvale. The Quel’Dorei have sat on the Alliance. They weren’t the best of allies, but they did fight against the invasion.
So he is essentially saying if I moved I maybe could have stopped teldrassil from happening but its not easy to recognize your old friend is totally evil.
That is suppose to address what the Horde did?
Seems like very weak and reserved excuses for the Horde player’s benefit.
So what? That addresses nothing what I talked about.
I don’t care what side he is leaning on.
He is no better than Sylvanas when he chose to support her at Lordaeron and the entirety of the war campaign until Najatar.
Except they were chill about it.
There is zero evidence that they weren’t.
Besides Saurfang not a single Horde character has directly characterized Horde’s latest mass slaughter as monstrous, evil or reprehensible.
And even Saurfang was motivated by his version of the Horde rather than what he helped do.
Infact he actually AGREED with Sylvanas as he watched Teldrassil burned.
This is a harsh quote and perhaps not entirely accurate, but player Sargeras’ advocate the Sin’dorei don’t have a total record of the Kal’dorei’s side of events during the many millennia spent apart. And on the High Elf side, in the years immediately preceding the Third War where they’ve fought demons and the Scourge (and died horribly), they fought the orcs, and also helped to fight demons with the human magi.
I imagine a lot of it might be the bitterness of the Night Elves leaning against the Sin’dorei preceding Burning Crusade, as well as Quel’thalas getting slaughtered by the Scourge.
