I’m so spoiled by Makani’s Nathanos/Sylvanas interactions that anything else will be a huge let down.
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That’s so wild, considering the leading pre-Chronicle theory was that Fel and Arcane were related, such that one was fundamental while the other was a cleansed/corrupted form of the other. But Fel and Life? Truly madness.
look, sylvanas is cool but i want her story and constant spotlights to be over already. hope the book is good, but. sylvanas.
At this rate, we’ll be seeing them return for 10.0, then.
No, the problem with the Gathering was Calia.
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“Some were running back here, to safety,” he replied.
“They were,” she agreed. “But how much of that was fear? How tempted were they until that point?” She shook her head. “No, Nathanos. I cannot take the risk. The only Desolate Council members I trust are the ones who returned to me early on, broken and bitter. Truly Desolate. All the others…I cannot allow that sentiment, that hope, to grow. It is an infection ready to spread. I have to cut it out.”
Hope was the actual issue. Of finding common ground with the living.
Calia was the problem in-so-far as she represented that.
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She was a controversial figure who insisted to come along to the first diplomatic overtures between two unfriendly and waring factions. Agreed to with terms by Sylvanas and Anduin. Anduin knew it was wrong but she weaseled her way in by promising she would remain hidden. She did not do that and actively recruited Forsaken to defect. She, not Sylvanas, destroyed any chance of opening relations between the Alliance and the Forsaken.
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Any controversy around her is silly, in my opinion.
As Anduin protests, no, she came as a healer.
Anduin nodded. “It’s to be expected. That’s why I asked Calia to participate, too. Seeing the two of them side by side, priests of the Light, so obviously comfortable with each other, is a good introduction to what they’re going to encounter shortly.”
Her eyes shone, and she gave him a tremulous smile. “You understand,” she said.
“I do,” he said. “And I know that having you participate in the Gathering is the right thing to do.” As he spoke, he felt warmth and calmness steal through him. That warmth passed through their clasped hands to Calia, and he saw the lines around her eyes and mouth lessen, her body relax. Whatever betided, this act of kindness was the right thing. Anduin had to hope that they would not pay too dear a price for it.
Sylvanas was the one doing all the killing, lol. Specifically to ‘not allow hope to grow’. She needs people ‘broken and bitter’.
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I think a lot of people overlooked the nuance of the Gathering due to various agendas. It was a good social experiment, and had many results (both in its build up and during).
To start, it was surprisingly hard for Anduin to drum up a couple dozen volunteers. Most humans still hate and fear Undead because of the Scourge; but a growing minority do hate and fear them the Forsaken for what they themselves have done. Of those that did agree, there were quite the number that took one look at the Forsaken across the field and turned away. Sadly, resulting in many Forsaken having the idea that “they will never accept you” reinforced (and this was the only group of Forsaken allowed to survive that event btw). There were also a small handful (2-3 families) that completely hit it off, to the point where they were ready to defect.
I think Genn however pointed out the most interesting group and result. Those in the middle of those rejected outright, and those few accepted back. There were those that met with their loved ones, only for both sides to (sadly, but amicably) realize they had very little in common anymore. And to parted on peaceful terms. Meaning that toleration and mutual acceptance (even if not reconciliation) can be achieved.
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I’m exaggerating a bit for effect, but when people started panicking and defecting at the gathering, Calia had that one line where she was like “Yes! Come to me, your true queen! I will lead you now!” and I found it super weird, creepy, and seemingly out of character for her. For a while I suspected a secret Calia heel turn.
I don’t know, I just couldn’t ever stop mulling over that strange line of hers. Like she had some kind of secret dark side to her.
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Ugh… nice cherry picking. Do I really have pull out my copy of Before the Storm to post the whole dialogue between Anduin and Calia. He didn’t want her to go because he knew she would be trouble!!! She promised to remain hidden and only go as a healer. She didn’t do that.
It was a tense diplomatic moment for both sides, which is why they picked an agreed upon neutral territory and each side brought their own security. It could have been the start of real relations between the Alliance and Forsaken if it wasn’t for Calia.
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The lines I quoted happen after. He has a momentary concern that goes away. These are different scenes. Ugh…
“You have not let it be so. Stormwind is fortunate to have you. But if you truly wish to thank me, I have a favor to ask. Of both you and the archbishop. I’d like to participate in the Gathering.” Anduin frowned slightly. “I don’t think that is wise,” he said. “There
may be those who recognize you. It could be dangerous. It could be… misconstrued.” It could, in fact, lead to war.
“If any of the Forsaken do recognize me, it will give me the chance to show that I bear them no ill will,” she countered. “That I have no desire to run them out of the place that’s been their home for so long. I want them to stay there. I want them to be safe.”
Anduin watched her carefully, taking a breath and centering himself. Light—let me know if she means them harm. He felt no responding ache in his bones, no hint that Calia Menethil was planning some kind of murderous coup. Her intentions were in alignment with the Light they both served.
“I’ve already established a bond of trust with these people we’ve interviewed,” she continued. “And no one knows the archbishop better than I do.”
This was true. And no one knew her better than Faol. “I will speak with the archbishop,” Anduin said at last. “If he is agreeable, then I am, too.”
His moment of concern is just that. A moment.
And if not for Sylvanas killing all those people.
And desiring to stifle hope.
And encourage bitterness.
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Again, cherry picking… Calia was the one who started the whole fiasco.
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What’s cherry picked? Can you explain? There’s only a handful of scenes where Anduin expresses his feelings about Calia going. The two later ones I saw have him saying he thinks it is a good idea.
Sylvanas was the person who decided to kill people for deciding to leave and some just for possibly having “hope”. What part about that is untrue?
If the people leave with Calia, there’s still real relations for the Forsaken and Alliance.
With Sylvanas killing any with hope, that’s removed.
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Sylvanas started killing people because Calia was there recruiting people to defect.
Yes, and that was her choice. At the end of the day, we have a few possible results.
- She doesn’t kill them. Which seems to let people reconnect more.
- She does kill them. Which seems to let people not reconnect more.
Hence why I blame Sylvanas. I don’t think there was any good necessity in killing those people.
Yes and bringing Calia was Anduin’s choice.
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He could have said, No you’re not going. You’re too controversial for this first Gathering of Forsaken and Alliance.
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Sure, you the sister of Arthas who raised the Forsaken as undead; turned Sylvanas into a Banshee and you may actually have titles to Lordaeron, sure you can go as a hidden healer.
He should have chose 1.
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Ok, but that doesn’t remove Sylvanas as the actor who chose to kill the people. There’s no removing that as her decision when it was unnecessary, even with Calia there.
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The Horde: Centuries old tradition of seeking wisdom from elders and spirits past- easily gets corrupted by demons and the realm of the dead. Get fooled into evil twice.
Anduin: Does his bones hurt? No? Then it’s a good idea. Is never wrong.
You can’t make up this absolute buffoonery and yet they did.
Edit: If you get a notification Frankenfiend that was a mistake on my part.
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The bones thing bothers me so much because it was like, ‘dang, Anduin has faced a consequence for his actions. They said he’ll feel pain for the rest of his life and won’t really be able to function the same.’
The bones do magic now and he’s fighting on the front lines easily.
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