The point is… you implied that in-game humans were based on real world humans, and you seemed to be saying that the goblins weren’t. I’m saying all races are based on real-world humans. I personally feel no real connection the Stormwind humans. The closest races that fit me are… Gnomes due to my lifestyle? Tol’vir or Brokers due to my ethnicity.
There is no “free” health care. They did have universal health care, though other countries have achieved that with much less repression.
And they had a government who told them what to do and took a portion of what they produced. Landlords in all but name.
I am saying the Goblin way could be more than a replay of some usual assumptions about he human society the writers happen to live in. Goblin society has been shown to highly individualistic and entrepenurial, using that might have made the story significantly more interesting.
It also could be used tp have the Goblin’s society be one that has a perspective that is worth understanding. Rather than be another Horde race that needs “fixing”
So… there was free health care. And if you were to name any of the countries you’d consider less repressive, I’d almost certainly be able to name some imperialist war they fought or supported that killed millions. Britain killed 100 million people in India alone from 1880-1920. The commonly cited civilian death toll for all communist countries is 100 million. The British still benefit from that stolen wealth.
All I’m saying is that it’s absurd to demonize the USSR while not holding other nations to the same standard. Either they’re all evil, or none of them are. Never once did I defend Stalin’s purges or any forms of repression they may have used.
And Western countries do the same. Loom at the prison population in the U.S. for non violent crime. They also prop up or have propped up right-wing dictatorships to do their work for them in other countries
That’s not an inherently bad idea. Right-wingers in America will praise tax cuts as “You get to keep more money in your pocket”, while gutting social services. Much food is produced by corporate farming. Taking it to help the poor would make me salivate.
I don’t think that qualifies as long as you aren’t threatened with eviction for lack of payment.
Well, a replay of some usual assumptions about society IS what the Goblins were, a satire of hyper-capitalist societes. Gazlowe, imo, is simply being turned into a regular boss, rather than being Tony Soprano or Phil Leotardo.
The problem with that is the way Goblins have been previously portrayed, it sort of does need to be fixed. It was never portrayed as a functioning society people would want to live in, as opposed to Stormwind.
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OK, leaving aside the glories of Marxism…
I found it to be an uninspired portrayal of capitalism as evil. I’m sure, if it matches one’s own political view point, it might have appeal. But I found it trite and did nothing you couldn’t do with humans and lost Goblin individualism.
Well, I don’t agree, but even if it did, I find that using them as you would use any human group missed opportunity.
again “pay your actual employees, dummy” is actually entirely different than humanity in wow’s ethos, at least Stormwind
That is the same point covered in the Defias story…
Where did you read this? Gazlowe is still being fully capitalist, just using different tactics than the trade princes to profit. Like realizing repeat customers and recommendations are a way to profit. As is minimizing unplanned downtime…
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Mcdonalds is capitalism
Mcdonalds ice cream machine is always broken
therefore capitalism is broken machines, therefore communism is when machines are fixed. QED
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Just so we’re on the same page here, I was talking about the potrayal of Goblins before this book. I thought you were the one who was saying you liked their portrayal before this book. If you think the Goblins’ portrayal was uninspired before this book, I would agree. If you thought the previous portrayal was worth salvaging, I would love to hear how you would do so.
I think even Blizzard agrees. They have even said outright that Goblins and Gnomes were little more than comic relief in an interview sometime last september. I doubt they had any actual failth in the design. I tried to find it for a bit, but my Twitter is on the fritz.
most of the story was just “capitalism is evil”.
Gazlowe could be headed toward a capitalist alternative. But it was a vague thing only at the end.
If they had presented, for example, him suceeding with a motivated and entrepreneurial work force, leaving others in the dust, it would have been a much better story than portraying Goblins as needing fixing because of Capitalism with a little bit of “Gazlowe has a plan” tacked on at the end.
You’re reading a lot into that that isn’t actually there.
I mean, yes they go after the trade prince style which is an exploitative fast profit at the cost of long term sustainability (of the business, not in the ecological sense) that overworking labor and neglecting your machinery is a bad short sighted thing, but none of that actually argues against capitalism on its own.
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I think is it pretty clear. But you are welcome to disagree.
Yes, the goblin that keeps going on about making profits through the story is anti-capitalism.
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I legitimately don’t understand how anyone is getting this out of the story.
He is a businessman saying that working more efficiently and having a repeat customer base is better than cutting every corner possible and only working with people with no other options.
Gazlowe is the quintessential positive depiction of a capitalist.
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https://www.millenium.org/news/406685.html
It’s in French
Morgan Day: " You know, World of Warcraft is a huge game with a great diversity of characters and personalities and as Patrick said it can happen that some of them are a little more “ridiculous” or perceived in a different way. The Goblins for example! But we strive to ensure that World of Warcraft remains a welcoming game with an equally welcoming environment that players can identify with, sometimes even reminding them of their own somewhat “strange” nature. " or “serious”.
That being said, often the most important characters are quite straight-laced, we have never really seen Jaina joke to this extent about the events she observes. We’re just trying to create the most inclusive world possible so players can relate to it at any given time. There are therefore clearly certain passages where the characters can go too far in terms of humor, but overall the narration still remains quite oriented towards very serious subjects.
Goblins were meant to be seen as ridiculous, Jaina is meant to be a serious character. So to defend the original way Goblins were portrayed, would not be defending any serious attempt at worldbuilding.
I mean, when you look at the venture company and say their big problem is that their business practices drove customers away, that’s peak communism there.
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I mean all the races in the game are based on humans in some way or another.
I mean, by that logic - What is the point of having different characters in each race if their entire race acts the same?
Characters should be written as individuals, even if their racial culture has certain ideologies or customs.
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That’s ludicrous. there are countries that are far far worse than the United States in different areas. No American factory can in the present day get away with doing anything close to how Foxconn in China operates. On the other hand, compared to Western Europe Americans work harder, get paid less, get very little time off and are faced with a medical system that’s more efficient in driving them to the poor house than giving medical care.
And Stalin was a certifiable nutcase about as psychopathic a ruler as Hitler or Pol Pot, or Chairman Mao.