New Anduin Cinematic

because you have no arguments left. Because your argument stop making sense in one moment if you take a better look at it.

Arthas and Sylvanas both did terrible things, horrible things. Sylvanas later went even much further than Arthas, and yet Arthas is supposed to be worse? That does not make sense.

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I know you can’t grasp when people are done fighting about a topic, but I’m exhausted over this. Take your pathetic attempts at insulting me elsewhere

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So why even try and correct them if it didn’t matter?

Because I felt the need to when I looked it up, just like you felt the need to correct me when I was wrong. But it doesn’t change my point with that being the case. I have no problem admitting that I was wrong about it. It was still 8 months ago, closer to a year ago than not.

If you had just corrected me that the date I drew from was off, I would’ve just acknowledged that. Your reddit upvote farming clapback is what is cringe and what I take exception with.

Here’s the sitch as far as I see it:

  1. Sylvanas had agency and free will. Her actions have been of her own choosing, and the Ranger-General soul fragment does not significantly alter who she is now. If this is true, it is not possible to redeem her, because her actions are unforgivable.
  2. Sylvanas did not have true agency or free will. Her actions were (retroactively) the result of being manipulated by forces beyond her control, and the Ranger-General soul fragment was a fundamental component of Sylvanas that, once missing, resulted in the genocidal Banshee Queen taking shape. If this is true, you’ve just ruined one of the faces of your franchise, because the character people had grown attached to over the years doesn’t exist anymore (and no, Afrasiabi saying “she’s always been this way, remember?” does not magically rewrite pre-BfA Sylvanas).

I’m not sure that Arthas really matters here. I think it was short-sighted and dumb to dangle him in front of people like he would have some meaningful chapter in the Shadowlands only to pull the rug out from under them with the fading soul mote routine. Arthas was a fan favorite before all this Jailer nonsense was plastered across the setting like a big diarrhetic hose. There isn’t a way they could have handled him at this point that would have been received well by fans, because the entire Arthas chapter of the game has already been retroactively ruined by Jailer’s Plan All Along. Be thankful only a wisp remained that couldn’t be sucked into the dual narrative singularities of Sylvanas and Anduin.

Ultimately, I don’t think the story team is willing to wrestle with the fact that Sylvanas as a character cannot be salvaged. And that sucks, because they weren’t the ones who started her down this route, and Patty Mattson is absolutely killing it with her performances, but at the end of the day it is what it is.

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we know from multiple - multiple - sources that sylvanas had indeed free will. The Jailor didn´t enslave her, he manipulated her. But in the end, their were her own choises.

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Yep, which leaves us with what is the likely outcome: every other character in the world gets sucked into the reality warping gravity of Sylvanas’ trajectory and just decide that however they felt about her doing a genocide or killing their loved ones is no longer important because she said she would never serve the Jailer that one time and something something her burden to bear.

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Oof, not me. I prefer a less AA meeting version of Sylvanas. I prefer to party with Sylvanas while shes high on hate, revenge and denial.

Sober Sylvanas is horrible.

You haven’t been paying attention. No one gets a happy ending in Wow. Ask Zelling or the Redpath family.

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Closure? You’re kidding. Sylvanas got the last word and I can’t believe Jaina and Uther just listened.

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It would have been better if Sylvanas had always planned to betray the Jailer, but it failed and she escaped like a CIA agent with a burn notice. She goes to ground for a few expansions, then pops back in from time to time as an anti-hero. I would be happier with a Sylvanas somewhere between Jarlaxle and that scumbag CIA spook from netflix’s Punisher. I would be happier with Sylvanas as the kind of villain you foil, but dont defeat. Jack Nicholson from A Few Good Men is another example. We almost got that in Mok’ Gora.

“Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be
guarded by men with guns. Who’s gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I
have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep
for Santiago, and you curse the marines. You have that luxury. You have
the luxury of not knowing what I know. That Santiago’s death, while
tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and
incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don’t want the truth because
deep down in places you don’t talk about at parties, you want me on that
wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty.
We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something.
You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination
to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the
very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I
provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your
way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either
way, I don’t give a dmn what you think you are entitled to.”

An unrepentant Sylvanas would be so much better than the one we got.

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This kind of self justifiying crap has been turned over by scumbags of multiple venues time and time again.

It doesn’t change the fact that the Frank Castles are wrong. And if your society needs a Section 31, a Judge Dredd, or a Batman, than your society is in a serious case of neglected maintenance and correction. Because despite the presence of Batman, Gotham gets worse instead of better, because Batman is an excuse not to fix what’s wrong with it.

The answer is not to rely on wolves to protect the sheep, but to fix your society so that the sheep can become strong through awareness and cooperation. And less wolves created in the first place.

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That is not totally true. Pelagos for one is getting a version of “happily ever after” what with him becoming the new arbiter, getting a purpose and for the most part not dying.

Thus far Chen has gotten one as well. He has a new home and as I recall he was settling down with that priest pandaren.

Again, there is a word IF there for a reason. There might be a chance the whole “renewal” thing will be used to just excuse Sylvanas but we will see.

He better put that fire out in the Brewhouse first. :slight_smile:

Lorewise, that has already happened. We did save said brewery.

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Come on, Drahliana, say something right lol.

No. If someone is jaywalking they deserve to get shot.

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No. I’m not kidding. Closure isn’t about “who said the last thing”. IDK why some people think it has to be.

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It makes for interesting characters still. Why does every character need to be right?

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Characters can be interesting, but Punisher wannabes are so common that the trope is getting a bit fatigued.

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