As a mage fighting other ppl for drops and mods I don’t think so maybe now that things died down. Also got the achievement for every zone I quested in.
At this point with my warrior alt I’m not bothering to read the quest and yet have had to fight for mods.
You get that we were talking about PUGS on opening day of Nax right? Nobody, not one single person said high gear score is required for nax. Literally nobody anywhere.
What we said, was why would anybody take somebody in greens and quest blues, when people were already pre raid BiS. Gear is not the end all be all determining skill, but it provides a huge buffer helping to mitigate lack of player skill.
Again, week 1 day 1 of nax. If you’re looking to push content that fast and that hard you have no business crying when you’re passed on for somebody with more gear. And because of how overly easy it is to get gear in Wrath, there is no excuse “if you’re trying to push content to week 1 day 1 of a raid”, for you not to have the gear to help offset the lack of skill you may or may not have. Again… PUG, no way to know if the person is skilled or not.
If its a guild run and you want to take a carry in greens, by all means do it.
If you didn’t wintergrasp spam that 1st week when you could Queue for more than 1, then yes it’s 100% more time consuming than doing 2 daily heroic world tours.
Well, I used my xp per hour, I guess I should not have done that. As somebody pointed out not everybody can solo spam dungeons for upwards of 1.5 million xp an hour.
That said, on my warrior I’m currently questing only and I’m getting between 850k and 1 million an hour “depending on how much I’m focusing”. The warrior is very geared though so I’m sure that’s speeding things up. I don’t however have flying yet since the warrior is on a different account than my pally sadly.
different battlenet account aswell? if not you can send account bound stuff over. i tried it, it works
I’m bored, I’ll test my mage for an hour questing and see what kind of xp I get. 0 rested xp on him, I just restarted the account today.
I’m guessing between 600 and 700k though. Maybe less because I’m kinda garbage at mage.
Edit: I have 3 bars of rested just from today
Guild leader: So, person who started late, you want to come to our Ulduar raids?
Eager guild newbie: Yes!
GL: So, you fully Naxx geared?
EGN: Eh no, can I go to your Naxx raids?
GL: I dunno, you fully Ulduar geared?
EGN: …
You can get screwed over in Naxx by bad healers and people failing mechanics still.
They’re being pathologically self-interested. The gear requirements actually aren’t difficult, it’s that they want an easy ride for themselves, so your gear has to be meeting their ‘check’.
Naxx is serious business
Or maybe we feel that if everybody else in the raid put in the time and energy to get the gear, then why can’t you? If you didn’t have time, or just dinged 80… then take the week to do the 24 heroics required to get 90% of your BiS gear before you get butthurt for being passed on by a PUG.
It would be one thing if the person doing the gear check was rocking greens and not letting you in. But if everybody in the raid is 198+ item level, why should we be obligated to take somebody who has put little to no effort into their gear with no enchants, no gems and thus making the run slower for everybody?
If it’s a guild run, and the guild don’t mind taking a player in greens and blues, then have at it. Nothing wrong with it, I’m sure nax will still get cleared.
If it’s a pug, you have no right to get butthurt if you get passed on if everybody else is geared and ready and you’ve done nothing to add a net positive to the raid. Simple as that.
Some people don’t require as high item levels of gear to function. The effort in the raid is what matters, by the by.
I’d be more inclined to check someone’s arena rating/achievements than their gear. Knowing how to play the game and not die to frogger is a lot more important than, say, sitting in a GDKP.
Opposite rationale here. If you’re a guild and your group is finely tuned and you’re looking for someone to fill then you have every right to find someone who’s equal to what your missing guildy’s standards are. If you’re a pug, odds are you’re in a pug for the same reason the other dude you’re inviting is in the pug. Pot, meet Kettle.
If somebody has high arena rating or good raid achievements, odds are they are not in quest blues and greens thus, this is a non issue to begin with. So your argument is quite moot.
True, but this is a PUG, the people probably don’t know one another. There is no way to know if the player has the skills to function. Gear makes up for what could be a lack of skill providing a nice buffer.
This honestly makes no sense as an argument. At least no logical sense. If I’m pugging for whatever reason, and I’m putting together that pug run I’m not going to take somebody in quest blues and greens and HOPE that they dont suck. I’ll take somebody who has put a little effort in and has the gear buffer to make up for their potential lack of skill. I don’t want to waist my time, or the time of those who I’m grouping with.
True.
but effort is not something you can check.
But gear is.
And gear is an indicator of effort to some degree, just like arena/achievements, which you mentioned aswell.
And even considering effort, if 2 people have vastly different gear, and put in the same effort, the one with better gear will still perform better.
Thats just how the game works.
Its undeniable that naxx25 is extremely easy, the only check that exists is wether people have basic movement abilitys (turned on their monitor) and having tanks that surviv a hateful strike at patchwork.
But still, having gear requirements - why not ? As long as the requirements are in a logical setup, i dont mind it.
In the example of naxx25, i would set a requirement between 185-195 ilvl average.
That is achieveable with low effort, and guarantees that atleast from your stats, you can contribute something to the raid.
Problems with requirements have always been, when people startet putting up stupidly high values, like requiring a gearscore thats close to, or even above what one would have with fullgear from the raid they where searching for.
But even that might be legit, for example if you search for specific activitys like badgerun, or speedrun.
So every BC Gladiator who didn’t win their rolls just doesn’t exist this week?
Past matters too.
But if you’re in a guild full of BIS people you’ll take someone in greens along for your run? A guy who’s gonna compete with whoever else you’re bringing along most certainly because he needs all the gear? A guy who’s gonna make it rougher to grab the achieves that you’re probably going to go for - since you’re a guild?
If you’re in a PUG, you’re also pugging just like the dude in greens. Again, Pot, meet Kettle.
Here’s the thing: If you’re pugging you’re already expecting to waste more of your time than if you were in a guild. Guilds are more refined hence one of the driving forces behind trying to find one of them. Being more refined means having a higher standard. You’re treating a PUG like it’s a guild. It’s not.
that would make sense, if not for the vast availability of badge earned loot.
No matter how unlucky your heroic drops/rolls are, badges are a given.
I´ve been unlucky on several itemslots, even tho ive been doing the heroics since 2 days after release on a daily shedule. So i opted to get some alternatives that are easily achieveable, like pvp items.
And if you are missing the one item that you can not easily get, like the one trinket from Cyanigosa (i cant really think about anything else that you could NOT get an alternative from a safe source), you are still far beyond “quest blues and greens”, whilst having low effort to get it.
You don’t have to “win rolls” to get close to pre raid BiS. 12 out of 17 items for the vast majority of classes are rep rewards, crafted, or badge gear.
How do you know the person wasnt just in a DKP run as a pure buyer? Or that they paid for a carry?
If we are taking a dude in all greens, it’s going to be another guildy that we are trying to get up… I would not bring a pug in to roll on gear vs my other members, I would rather have that spot empty.
If we are going for achievments then of course we are not gonna take a green geared player. What are you even talking about here lol Do you hear yourself?
But if I’m pugging, I dont have quest blues and greens. So no, it’s not the pot calling the kettle black at all. Again, do you even think about the things you type?
Right so all the more reason to make sure the players in the pug are decently geared. Horrible argument on your part.
No, I run my pugs, when I do run them with the expectation that the players have put at least minimal effort into their characters. One easy way to determin that is via their gear. And again, that gear acts as a buffer of skill for a player that I don’t know.
Are you just trolling or are these legit arguments you’re trying to make?
I ran Naxx 10/25, OS 10/25, EoE 10 and did every daily. From Emblems I have boots and ring. Heroics offer a few pieces but the lockout is daily and not everyone can afford to run every single lockout every day.
Point: you don’t need all prebis for Naxx, especially not 10m. People were clearing Naxx back in OG Wrath in their BC gear fresh out of 79. Yes, this version is buffed but everyone is also more informed, and that knowledge makes it easier.
An unlucky person who doesn’t let the screen absorb them is going to have maybe a valor piece and some heroism pieces. The rest could be garbage. Doesn’t mean they’re bad, and that certainly doesn’t mean they shouldn’t get to run Naxx 10.
And how many heroics/dailies does it take to get every rep piece you would want? Because it’s also a timesink.
How do you know that now? It’s almost like gear is just as fallible so maybe you shouldn’t only use that and set it to some nonsense standard.
Unless it’s not and you need to PUG one. You’re moving goalposts. This was about pugging someone.
Unless that pug only wants badges and has gear already. Weird, it’s just like I said: you have higher standards w/ guild runs.
Do you? You think pugs go for achieves more than guilds?
So you prove my point in that guilds have higher standards. Thanks.
Ah so you started in epics/ilvl 197? No? Then why’re you going to gatekeep the dude who is more than likely in the same gear that you were?
Except it’s not because you’re assuming that you’re somehow infallible yourself and not going to screw things up despite being Mr. Geared. You’re using gear as a pure metric. It’s a bad one. That is the point.
“Minimal” is not doing all heroics every day plus dailies plus PvP just so you can turn your nose up at the one green Argent questline trinket.
You’re the wannabe elitist here. You tell me.
Nobody said you need prebis for Naxx. Show us where we said that. Your argument has no legs to stand on because you’re not even arguing the points we are making.
Again, this is verafiably not true. If you were the most unlucky person in the world, if you do 24 heroics “the equivlant of 2 world tours” + the emblems you got while leveling through all the zones, you will have enough emblems for your chest, gloves, trinket, off hand, and be 20 short of your neck.
In doing those 24 heroics that’s also enough to get you exalted with 2 factions providing even more gear. Then add on whatever crafted gear there is for your class and you’re at least 10 out of 17 items at ilvl 200. And again that’s assuming your’e the most unlucky person of all time and got 0 blue upgrades out of heroics.
With questing through all the zones excluding icecrown it takes 24 total heroics to get all of your badge gear minus your neck. If you quested through icecrown as well, then you would have every badge item available.
I don’t know that now, but using gear as the determining factor, even if they are bad, the gear as I said I don’t know how many times now acts as a buffer for lack of skill.
Again, if its a guild run we are not going to pug somebody in all greens. We would just leave the spot empty and 9 or 24 man it. There is hardly any difference vs taking a person in greens.
You talk out of both sides of your mouth a lot. If it’s a pug and he’s in greens, we are not bringing them to a guild run. I’ve said that multiple times now… If I’m MAKING A PUG. NOT A GUILD RUN. Then I’m not bringing a person in all greens either so the point is moot. I’ll bring somebody who has a gear buffer to make up for any possible lack of skill.
What in the actual hell are you talking about?
Typical of your ilk, taking what I said out of context.
I was 200 ilevel when I went in to nax on Thursday. You’re assuming I didn’t put the time in to get the gear now? You do know that 200 ilevel is what heroic gear is right?
Actually that’s literally the opposite of my argument. My argument is the GEAR PROVIDES A BUFFER. If I do screw up, and I have… I’m not perfect. The gear helps mitigate the screw up. I don’t understand what you dont get about this… Either you’re really really REALLY slow. Or you’re trolling.
Minimal is not showing up in quest blues and greens. I didn’t say they needed to be BiS. not once have those words ever been typed by me on this thread. Not a single time.
If somebody was short a handful of items, but they clearly have put in effort then I would not turn them away. Again, I don’t know where you came up with this argument that I’m saying you need BiS… that’s not ever what I said. I simply said ITS EASY TO GET.
How am I an elitist? You keep using that word, I’m not sure you know what it means
And how many other slots is that not that could be, dare I say, green?
I hope you’re not talking about the 200 purples that people are charging thousands for that are basically equal to Naxx 10 - the thing you’re apparently trying to gatekeep. So, “pay money or don’t come”, hm?
And every badge item is 4 slots. Rep could be another couple. Crafted gear costs a lot of money. The blues that can be crafted efficiently are not 200.
You do realize that heroics are so laughably easy that you could run them with what is essentially a man down? So no, not really.
No, you’re not! Because you’re a guild! And guilds can be picky because they’ve spent all that time tailoring themselves! You, on the other hand, want to reap the rewards of that specific tailoring without the effort. You’re no better than the other pugs in terms of this.
Then why do you think having the same gatekeeping standards is all right for you if you’re not going through the effort of running a guild group?
Maybe I’m talking about the dude who has guild-like standards for people while he’s pugging.
Not out of context at all. You have guild-level-standards while trying to form a pug. Have one’s cake and eat it to.
That’s great! Some people don’t have all that time to invest, but you know what? There are some of those who are in 187, maybe even 175 ilvl average, that know how to play their class better than you! And they’re not signing up for roles that are that gear-dependent (dps)! But you’re going to gatekeep those people because you think gear is a guarantee of skill (or a “buffer”) when it’s not.
Yep, a buffer for you. The
Is that you’re:
Says gear is an indicator of effort.
Says someone who is missing pieces would be invited if they showed clear effort, but by your logic someone who is missing pieces and has green quest ones hasn’t “shown clear effort”.
Which is it?
I’m not sure you know what it means. You’re the one who’s being inconsistent.