“There’s lying, there’s damn dirty lying, and then there’s statistics.”
Because data science is deeper than that. There’s no point arguing with someone who doesn’t know what they’re talking about but says it with their whole chest. You can’t change someone’s mind who doesn’t understand their own point.
+10 meta is very wide. So already done?
Yeah, and then there’s the PC Gamer article talking about how M+ is “struggling.” That’s a fairly major games publication agreeing with us for people to say we’re all just imagining this…
“Compared to Dragonflight specifically, we are seeing a pretty sharp decline in Mythic Plus participation in The War Within,” Raider .io general manager Kelsey Cox told PC Gamer. "Almost every season will see a decline in participation numbers from Week 1 of that season, but in most of the Dragonflight seasons the numbers stayed pretty steady after the initial Week 1 drop-off.
“That’s not what we’ve been seeing in this current season though: TWW Week 14 had about one-fourth the Mythic Plus participation of Week 1, in terms of total dungeons done worldwide.”
Kinda par for the course
These are basically caused by the same bad game design. Which is fueled by their chasing e-sport nonsense. Instead of group wipes being caused by long drawn out exhaustion of group resources, they take place in the span of seconds. One is eXcItInG for people who watch streams, the other is better gameplay for the people playing the game.
Multiply health pools by ten, maybe even more. This fixes both tanks and healers having such a stress filled time. Revert the old decision to make healers have nearly infinite mana, and give them a variety of heals with differing mana efficiencies/throughput to make good healing a balancing act between inefficient but high throughput to make it through choreographed high group wide damage phases, and efficient heals when things are slower or it’s just the tank eating hits.
I don’t expect them to do this though, it would take an immense amount of effort on class reworks to make it real.
Because no one like health ticking away at 4% per tick and heals only healing 2%
Its also the nature of the beast with infinite scaling. At some point you cannot progress because the first hit will be a one shot.
Your solution (larger health pools and smaller heals) is exactly what tanks and healers do not want. And they were adamant about that. It makes for very boring playstyle as the tank is never in threat of dying and healers dont want to spend 15 GCDs on 25% HP
eh if people have a larger hp pool, then it has to be accompanied by a nerf to healing.
There’s a balance between burst vs just pushing anything (because anything will heal people to full.)
But many people advocating for these changes is because they think it will be easier, not because they want something of equivalent difficulty.
I’ve advocated for 3x hp pools, and a 50% healing nerf before.
For healing to be fun, people have to be able to die from lack of healing.
I think the current iteration is fairly close to this. Heals aren’t doing 60% a global any more and theres enough of a mix between consisten and spike damage.
Ewww
And you sound like you need to touch grass
M+ for LFG as an OCE player, +2-9 is completely dead for the OCE players. You can check that out on LFG by typing 2-9 OCE in a peak time. Many OCE groups need tank/healer and they disbanded early 90% of the time.
+10 meta is inviting any 635+, meta specs with 2800-3000+ will apply for +10. Everyone will pick 635+ meta specs with 2800-3000+ over non-meta specs for +10 keys every time.
Gearing alts for +8-10 is extremely tedious, you need a lot of runed crests and gilded crests to par with 620-625+ for +8 and 635+ for +10.
Yeah no, tank/healer still won’t play and we are in severe shortage of them. Do you have better solutions?
This could be a legit reason.
UI turns into a mess with DBM, Weakauras flashing all over that’s supposed to help players, and yet stuff you’re supposed to avoid can overload the eyes/brains.
I see Blizzard making some good changes to swirlies at least. Step in right direction.
They boxed themselves into a corner when they allowed add-ons to trivialize easier mechanics/encounters, forcing them to create increasingly elaborate/fast paced encounters that require those add-ons.
That power creep of encounters that expect weak auras, dbm, ect ect is something they needed to address several expansions ago. I had hoped they would stick to their plans to eventually cripple add-ons, but they chickened out at the end of dragonflight.
If the mechanic is almost impossible without add-ons, the mechanic should not exist, full stop. The trickle down effects from their still chasing mythic raiding as an e-sport has been a disaster for the game.
It isn’t. The source for your graph is Raider .io, and in that same PC Gamer article they interviewed the people who run that, and they said:
"‘Compared to Dragonflight specifically, we are seeing a pretty sharp decline in Mythic Plus participation in The War Within,’ Raider .io general manager Kelsey Cox told PC Gamer. 'Almost every season will see a decline in participation numbers from Week 1 of that season, but in most of the Dragonflight seasons the numbers stayed pretty steady after the initial Week 1 drop-off.
That’s not what we’ve been seeing in this current season though: TWW Week 14 had about one-fourth the Mythic Plus participation of Week 1, in terms of total dungeons done worldwide.’
In the Battle for Azeroth expansion, by comparison, about 50 percent more players were doing Mythic Plus dungeons in week 18 of its Season 4 as compared to Week 1, Cox said."
If I’m reading this right, that means we have eight times less people currently doing M+ in TWW S1 than in DF S4 as compared to the starting numbers for each. +50% in one case, -75% in the other.
They are specifically looking at week-over-week metrics in percentages. We have been discussing raw participation numbers of completed keys. They are also not accounting for the deletion of +2-11 keys when they briefly mentioned RIO stats.
Wouldn’t this coincide with corruption vendors?
You’re not.
They also had to go back nearly 8 years in order to make that claim.
If you look at the graph i posted, you can see that TWW is trending the same way it did in all of DF and the same trend from SL
BFA S1 was still new M+
And S4 in BFA (especially week 18) you had corruption gear and were getting ready for Shadowlands pre-patch.
The amount of cherry picking required to make that claim is pretty much a bad faith argument.
TWW S1 is trending in the same manner as the last 2 expansions. It’s par for the course.
100%
So you just don’t play anything that has levels above where you can play? Sounds…boring…being stuck to old maid and go fish type of games >.< yeesh
Its almost easier with the crest cap removal to run lower keys and upgrade the crests. You need to run three times the amount of dungeons but at least you can get into a +8 key if you have lower ilvl.
I only do M+ so they should delete raids, delves, and pvp. Get rid of pet battles too while your at it.
/s
What is it with people who don’t even participate in the content that get so invested in all M+ threads and calling for it to be removed or fundamentally altered for them?
I actually took a deeper look at the PC Gamer article in another thread a little bit ago. The article conveniently doesn’t mention that BFA S4 had 750K keys run in week 1 while TWW S1 was nearly 2.5 million. I feel like where a season starts is bound to have an impact on retention…