AV has been talked to death, ultimately…Blizzard decided it was exploitative. If you read the post detailing the change…there isn’t even glint that it was updated for “modern standards.”
Premading fighting pugs is completely acceptable, when both sides have the option to premade. It was explicit that AV was never intended to have 1-faction premades.
In Vanilla/Classic there’s only one championship trophy (ie pvp reward set) and therefore the Chicago Bulls, high school teams and kindergarteners are all head to head.
If Blizz was to create separate levels of PvP, they would have to create separate levels of PvP gear.
No matter how much evidence for the premade vs premade argument there is, the sweaties will forum pvp the issue because its not the game they want, its the easy honor farming. They do not want a fair game, they want the meta at the sacrifice of other peoples fun. They will counter valid arguments with repeaded trollish talking points. Understand that threads like this are trying to get the attention of Blizzard and not the tryhard sweaties. What the silver lining is that they more they defend the toxic behavior of farming honor by bumping these threads give more notice to Blizzard that there is indeed a problem.
Problem is this. You can argue things need to stay the same all you want. Some people have taken there lives over this through out the years. All because certain people are toxic and want to keep the status quo.
2013 - 38 year takes life after playing wow for 3 years.
2015 - 24 year old takes life after 19 hours of game play.
2017 - teenager takes life after being trolled in chat.
That’s just three articles and there many more. People play the game to have fun, others play games to take the fun away. People with mental health issues play games as a way to release the stress of life. The game shouldn’t add stress but it does.
Whether it was intended or not it was a change to the Vanilla system to generate an outcome that Blizzard in 2020 desired.
So in that same vein there is no reason that Blizzard couldn’t decide that while premade vs pugs did exist they did not exist to the level they do today and are creating a toxic experience for players.
Pugs facing premade did exist, but not like they do today. Back then I’d bump into one occasionally unless matches kind of started syncing up and you kept facing the same premade, in which case you just waited 5-10 minutes to break things up. However today at least 8/10 games is going to have you pulling a premade and that is not what many were expecting out of a Classic experience.
I would argue the change to AV was made to make it function more like it did in Vanilla.
I don’t understand how anyone who actively engaged with the honor system in Vanilla could expect anything else than what we have today. It’s not fun, it was never fun…nor was it ever about fun. It was always about farming pugs for their honor.
And when Blizzard said “You think you do, but you don’t”…this is exactly what they were talking about. Thankfully, nothing from pvp is good enough to be considered mandatory, and you always have the option to premade yourself.
If you were going for top ranks that may have been the experience, but there were far more that participated in the system that had no interest in reaching those top ranks.
I am a prime example of that. I got to Knight-Captain in Vanilla and then stopped. I did it all in Pugs and I can tell you what people are experiencing now is not what I experienced then.
Others like my wife did just enough every week to keep a title because she liked it. The ranking system was more than just a bunch of people trying to no life to Rank 14 and pug players running into a bunch of premades.
Perhaps things will settle down once PvE gear out-paces PvP gear, that is how I remember it. But my recollection of the start of the PvP system is very-much inline with how things are playing out now…except the class meta, strategy and tactics have all ready all been solved.
I am not saying your experiences are wrong, but just that mine are different and very much in line with what is happening now. But especially in the prime of PvP gear, there were entire guilds devoted to no-lifing BGs all-day-every-day.
Wasn’t there a 5 person group max at some point? Did I dream that?
They eventually did put in the premade v premade only system…exactly when escapes me…and I think anything sub-5man was considered a “pug” for the queuing system, and anything over that was considered a “premade.”
But certainly not in vanilla.
Yea the more I think about it, it may have been Wotlk or later.
It all runs together after this long
It most certainly does, that is for sure.
Pugs beat premades all the time. Maybe the issue is with the players in this thread.
“A PvP problem has a PvP solution” - it’s becoming increasingly clear this is a l2p issue.
How much flatulence is needed for it to be classified toxic airborne event?
Greatest reply of 2020.
Yes, this is sad. And that most likely is the tip of the iceberg. Its very wrong IMO to promote this. I wonder if there will be lawsuits in the future.
How about “no?”
Why not?
…
Didn’t take long.
Retail ----->