That would be great, but here is what my crystal ball is telling me:
They are going to be obsolete by season 2. They will go the way of Garrisons and Order Halls, and Expedition Islands, and Torghast.
It is a real tragedy too.
Yeah you just gave me the definition of group vs solo. But how is it more difficult on an individual scale? Don’t tell me in mythics you have to do the job of 2+ people? More?
No, you do the same thing you do in delves. As you said, you stay out of the fire and interrupt casts or else you die. So what’s the difference on an individual level?
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Because you are not the only person in the game, nor are casuals. The effects of this ripple through out the entire game.
Its a massive issue going on in M+ right now were you have a lot of people who have no idea what they are doing, but because of ease of access of gear flood into M+. As a result people have to start cracking down harder on Raider IO scores because its much harder to tell who a good player is vs who is casual player is when everyone’s Ilvl is near the same because gear is being handed out like candy.
Which we all know how much people LOVE to complain about raider IO.
So with the handing out of normal tier raid gear, you are going to see a rise in the need for raider IO this season more then in DF.
Its also causing lower keys to be starved for healers and tanks at the moment because healers and tanks are out gearing that level and jsut going into higher keys now since on average tanks and healers are generally better players at a higher skill they are outpacing the lower skilled players and leaving them in the dust to suffer in M+ wait times.
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How are you easily farming 8 keys a week?
4-6 easy. Do you have some way to force spawn wqs with key shards?
You do the same thing sure but at that point we can distell every single difficluty of the game into well you just do damage and dont die.
The difference is the lethality of Devles even at T11 vs M7. things hit WAY harder in Mythic 7, mechanics are WAY less forgiving in M7, in some cases telegraphed very poorly (This can honestly be attributed to blizzards issue) you also have affix mechanics to deal with which delves do not really have this. You have a timer to deal with, every time you die you are punished more.
Delves also have far fewer mobs that are engaged at any give time, at most I think i pull 3 normal mobs at any given time and deal with them, on T11 i can pull 1 MAYBE 2 mobs at a time.
Further more Delves have in built mechaincs to many of them that allow you to cheese the delve. For example any delve with a spore spawn you can cheese and have them blow up on the enemies to kill them. In the mine delve there are mine carts you can lead mobs into to kill them making it amazingly easy.
Oh i forgot to mention taht delves ALSO give you random buffs from treasure and brans abilities are insane.
The one where his abilities have a change to make it so you get a bonus +50% crit on a target is nuts
The shrink/grow one just is 20% more damage or 12% hastes, tahts an insane bonus.
You get 4 keys from your chests easy pzy right.
You can easily get 10 echos a week if not more, if you do echo memories with 5 DPS, and you turn in 5 echos at once, its easily over 150 shards, so there is another 3 keys, it usually leaves you with some spare change of shards as well, and then with WQ you can bang out key number 8.
I have done it every week so far.
I’m fairly certain we will see “timed” delves at some point for the solo players that will scale up similar to mythic with added affixes and better gear.
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That would be interesting as a higher tier difficulty.
But they would have to limit it to solo.
Oh, so they are desinged around one guy with these little things, you call cheesing. Okay. I was worried for a moment you might have a point. Silly me.
Lemme tell you what the difference is. It’s not that they are easier in the sense that you people want to make them out to be. It’s that they are simply much more accessible. That’s what kills you people. Cause others might have another option to get their loot and actually enjoy themselves instead of stepping int that miserable, infested, toxic craphole that mythic+ has become thanks to the community that formed around it.
I really hope that Blizzard keeps devles around and not only but also give it as much attention as they give mythic+.
Anyway, so far, I haven’t seen any negative impacts on the game aside you people claiming they are starving your mythic+ lower tiers. Well, it’s my opinion that you’ll survive, just like raiding survived mythics.
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4 keys a week, 4 echos from those keys.
Get shards from wqs, you now have a 5th key. That gets you a 5th echo.
Do a 5 echo, get 150 shards, granting you a 6th key.
Seems pretty dry after that. Don’t forget that you were able to bank up keys early before t8s unlocked and that increased the amount of gear people got, and increased the number of echos you can normally obtain.
That being said, if you can get 8 a week without banked keys, that does seem high in terms of drops.
It does.
/thread
Ok if you wanna be snide about it go for it, but im telling you right now form personals experience and the raw numbers.
Delves are monumentally easier to do, compared to M+ by a country mile and back.
Even T11, which is recommended for 623+ is easier then doing M+7
they are just as accessible as anything else, you can roll a tank or healer and get instant invites into M+s just like everyone else, if you chose not to do that, thats not a lack of accessibility thats a lack of you wanting to access it at the speed you desire to.
Weird take, but ok. Im down with more people doing more content. Thats not an issue i have, go forth and do more things.
My issue is that if you honestly think or are saying taht delves are some how harder or even on par with the effort needed to a M+ you are just factually wrong. Like by the numbers of the damage they do, they mechanics they have, the pace at which you can complete them. you are just wrong completely.
T8 and even T11 delves are monumentally eaiser then a M+7 is.
You also get them from the bonus chest as well i believe.
Even if its 7 keys thats super high for drops thats also not counting heroic drops from maps either which is another massive bonus.
It’s really not though, everyone is just looking at item lvl and screaming “delve gear is too good!!”
90% of the trinkets are hot garbage, the majority of loot that drops has pointless stats and none of it is remotely close to BIS… Yes it will boost your power and allow high IL conversions to T gear but in no way does it compete with heroic/mythic + gear.
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I’m kind of waiting on data on those for drop rates.
I’ve seen 1 map and I’ve done 8 t8s every week they’ve been available while other people have seen 2-3.
Maps should probably be removed as drops and be purchasable from the delve currency. Make them warband bound and a good way to gear alts.
If that means I don’t have to deal with lfg for m+, I’m all for it even if they bump up the difficulty of delves. I enjoy doing them at my own pace and not having to wait for an invite.
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Im right there with you on that one, i dont know what the drop rates on the maps are or if its 1 per week, just really rare, if its a scaling drop where you have a high chance to get your first map each week, if its a compounding drop rate where you can get 1 per week for each week of the season and you can get the past ones too. I just dont know what the map drop rate is.
Some have said they got 2 a week, so idk.
Problem with this is you would need to limit it someone because you cvould abuse that with alts
No, they are more accessible. We already went over this. You don’t do what you are supposed to, you die. It’s a wipe. Difference is, nobody except you in there to sperg out and rage quit and end it for everyone else.
And I never said they are on par with the effort you people put in your mythic+ but most of that effort comes from the issues you created on your own. With your moronic addons and elitist attitudes. The fact that you people are how you are to each other shouldn’t count as a difficulty mode. I just said they aren’t easier because, when it comes down to your own performance, you do the exact same things. You avoid to die by doing the mechanics while trying to kill the boss. What’s the difference?
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Regardless of damage tuning, or changing how loot is distributed, it’s the same result.
Increase difficulty so T4 = T8, but still get T4 rewards is the same as lower the rewards so T8 = T4 rewards.
No matter how you cut it, the end result is harder content for the same rewards.
Okay, but here’s the thing…in accordance to reward level…being geared for a T4 SHOULD feel like doing a T8, because you’re getting stronger rewards than the content youre fighting against.
If i’m completing T8s in <580 gear with no deaths in 10-15 minutes…then being 600 ilvl and receiving 603/616 is being overgeared. If you’re 600+ you should be completing 12’s with ease in 10-15 minutes.
So the difficulty matches the rewards. That’s how progression works. People are hitting level 80 and then jumping straight into Mythic raids and downing bosses. They’re doing lower tier dungeons while gearing up. That’s how that works
I don’t care what you get. My complaints have nothing to do with what other people are receiving. It is 100% my opinion based on my game play.
But it is. Let’s take reward levels as our level of comparison.
Go to the last boss in any T8 delve. As a dps with a crappy ai healer, you can solo this boss with ease. Go walk into an M+ 7 and walk up to a boss and do the same thing.
Same gear paths means same level of difficulty right? As a dps you should have no problems solo’ing that boss in about 90 seconds, 120 tops? At 603 ilvl of course. Would really hate to “over gear” this and trivialize content.
Please send video 
P.S. m+ has the same accessibility. Fly to dungeon/delve, enter dungeon/delve. That’s all there is.
What you described has nothing to do with accessibility. Conflating the two isn’t making the point you think it is.
I can confidently say that in the last 200 keys that I’ve ran that has involved a wipe, there hasn’t been a single rage quit or even a simple rage. And this all with the lovely PuG world and LFG
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Accessibility =/= dealing with scummy players.
Accessibility is the ability to access the content, nothing is stopping you from getting into groups or running your own keys. There is literally ZERO barrier for you to do that. The difference is, the effort to do each activity is vastly different.
Delves require very little effort because its just you.
Ok again ,this is not an issue with the M+ system, these are jsut scummy people. Which spoiler the only addon you actually need, and even then not a requierment is DBM, and half the time you dont even really need that either.
As for elitist’s, scummy people exist in all walks of the game, its not magically centered into M+ only. If you think M+ is bad you should see arena.
Even if you had a gorup of the most chill individuals ever, that were completely zen with one another and did not care one way or the other if the key bricked, M+ is still, by the numbers, by the mechanics, by everything, so much more difficult them Devles and even T11 delves.
Except again, its not the same, M+ you are not just looking out for your mechanics you have to look out for the meches of other people. Some times i as a tnak have to stun a target for the DPS or healer, i have to some times save my shock wave to clear orbs, I some times have to use intervene to save a DPS, I have to some times cast a fear, or a Commanding shout to help give the healer some breathing room.
You are NOT doing the same mechanics in Delves that you have to deal with in M+, M+ you have to do not only your own mechanics to save your skin, but keep an eye out for other people, tahts what separates the good players from the bad.
Delves you are only worried about yourself thats it that makes the monumentally easier.
Again im not sure why you have all this hostility in your posts im not even agrey or upset with you or even attacking what you think is more fun or better, the only thing i have said you are wrong on is that M+ are far harder the delves even at the highest difficulty of delves.