Modern Death Knight character customizations

Classes Death Knight
81

There are some braziers with blue flames, but I can’t think of any larger scale blue fires the size of carts or houses that would be big enough to fill the area behind Thassarian. My memory isn’t perfect, so do you have a place in mind for where the cover is set?

In my last post, I didn’t question whether you thought Alistra was a death knight or not. I said that was cleared up. You claim she’s a banshee, and that’s a valid possibility.

The thing is, though, there’s nothing official from Blizzard about what she is or isn’t. Otherwise, I wouldn’t have been able to walk into this discussion where I did. Yet you’re dealing in absolutes and say there is no chance that she can be a death knight. If you have any evidence to support that, this thread is the perfect place. I’m sure many people would love to have an answer on whether Alistra is an accurate subject to base death knight fantasy on. Even if it might not be what they want to hear, it would at least be final.

I will grant you that one of the Knights of the Ebon Blade being a banshee with a physical body has potential for whatever storytelling the writers felt they couldn’t do with Sylvannas. However, it strikes me as unlikely they’d possibly do that twice in the same expansion with Siouxie being on-the-nose about it, while Alistra was a secret banshee, and yet the writers still decide not to do anything with either.

So, if something looks like a pancake, smells like a pancake, and tastes like a pancake. It is most likely a pancake, until proven otherwise.

82

So there is blue fire. Acting like all fire is red/orange in this game so therefore his eyes can be any color is one of the worst arguments i have seen. Even Marrowgar shot out blue flames.

There is plenty of evidence to support she isnt a DK, ive listed it, then you went on to say “2nd gen DK then” which she couldnt be either. 2nd generation DK’s were loyal to the LK and didnt need to be controlled. They sought him out for power which he granted them and they cut out their hearts to prove they were loyal to him. So if she was one of these DK’s, around Lights Hope, she would have stayed loyal to him because she wouldnt have been controlled and it still doesnt explain the red eyes. But shes not a 2nd gen DK either.

While there is nothing official from Blizzard other than she was a trainer and she made a bet in Legion, this is still a universe with rules and you have to follow the evidence. When you take things as a lump sum, shes a Banshee that regained her body either though just finding it (or being allowed to find it if Arthas wanted a front line Warrior which she could have been) or just denouncing her original magic she was born with to accept necromancy and then broke free of the LK control at Lights Hope like those others that were present there that were actively being controlled.

Where is Siouxie? And other than some title how is she a banshee? Being a banshee isnt a title, its an actual thing. Siouxie is most likely using the “herald of death” definition banshee in her title, there is nothing else about her that says “banshee”. If you call something that looks like a pig, sounds like a pig, and smells like a pig, a duck… it doesnt make it a duck.

You have to use the evidence at hand. People arent doing that, they are looking for a half-baked reason to get red eyes in Blood spec (which Lady Alistra DOESNT support) or being so simplistic that if something is red then that means its a blood spell, and if something is blue then its a frost spell, and if something is green or purple then its an unholy spell.

These people would rather see the game ruined for their crappy customization wants, than to have a world to escape into.

83

You’ve done it! That’s what I most wanted from this discussion. It was brief, but you opened your mind to possibilities not your own.

Godspeed, Mooncat. :saluting_face:

84

I don’t know if someone has already mentioned this here but, are we aware that those blue eyes might be the explicit proof of Domination magic and nothing more?

There’s a theory about Aman’thul and the Primus on this. Remember how the Primus met a being in the timeways who taught him how to see the future? And how he might’ve taught Domination in return? The theory is that these blue eyes might be Order shoved into the realms of Death. Oribos and stuff, it’s all Titans controlling the universe and Zovaal was trying to change that.

As much as Arthas/LK was forced into the narrative, it’s still relevant because it’s about Death, and also might explain how these blue eyes aren’t even supposed to be a class-defining trait for DKs.

85

Honestly this is not entirely correct and the blue eyes is actually a link back to the original Death Knights raised by the first Lich King in addition to those raised by Arthas which is no longer relevant in current Death Knight lore.

So why did those original ones have Blue Eyes? Firstly ask yourself the following question -
What has the colour blue been used for throughout Warcraft Lore and in game?
While some might think of things like Water or Ice and somehow think that the eye colour is something like a link to the Frozen Throne, Icecrown etc that isn’t the case. Blue has always been used for Arcane/Order in game but it is actually more related to CONTROL or DOMINATION.

Yeap the blue eyes actually originally signified that those Death Knights were under the control of the Lich King. However, the Ebon Blade Death Knights & Player Death Knights have according to the game lore actually freed themselves which would clearly mean that their eyes would no longer actually be Blue. Just look at any of the in game cinematics where a character who is being controlled ceases to be controlled even for a couple of seconds… their eyes change colour you can see this with Anduin in Shadowlands when he breaks the control for a second or two then is dominated again… his eyes are BLUE while dominated and when he is free of the control they loose the blue colour for second or two then gain it again when he snaps back under the control.

This is what you’re are missing and not taking into consideration the lore behind the blue eyes for Death Knights is no longer relevant so the concept of having a range of eye colours other than blue is very feasible.

Actually it is not the same reason whatsoever…DH eyes have the fel green because of the transformation process and the fact that they have to be infused with a massive amount of Fel Energy for the transformation to happen.
The process in which Death Knights are created is a necromancy ritual where a corpse is raised in to undeath if anything it’s infusing Death with some aspect of Spirit to mimic Life. There is definitely no massive infusion of Arcane Energy or Domination Magic in that Necromancy ritual, however, as I mentioned originally there would have been some kind of final control step which provided the domination/control of the original Death Knights.
Finally while the original Death Knights did have clear signs they were under some type of domination or control aspect it was clear they did have some level of freedom of choice as well, so it was likely that the control was one that ensured they followed any orders they were given by the Lich King directly however, if they were given a task to achieve they could go about it in anyway they liked provided the task itself was achieved so the control was clearly there but definitely not the same as full domination like we saw with Anduin.

In terms of what could be used as Death Knight Potential Eye Colours that come to mind are - Sanguine Red (i.e Blood, Anima), Plague Green (i.e Pestilence etc), Frozen White (Remorseless Winter etc), or Solid Black (i.e Realm of Death) in addition they could keep the original Blue for those that wanted to keep it.

Just my two cents…

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86

Honestly this is not entirely correct and the blue eyes is actually a link back to the original Death Knights raised by the first Lich King in addition to those raised by Arthas which is no longer relevant in current Death Knight lore.

Agreed. There’ve been multiple cases of Death Knights without blue eyes, it’s silly to think that they only bear the blue eyes.

3 Likes
87

Yes and if you take a look around Archeus you will even see quite a few NPC Death Knights with various other eye colors other than blue.

In addition to that there is also the point that Lich King Bolvar actually had two eye colors, his default natural color was yellow however, when he wanted to fully tap in to the power of the Lich King through the Frozen Throne that’s when you get the whole chill of death, freezing etc. and his eyes turned to that of the Lich Kings who came before him.

You can see exactly what I am talking about if you check the Shadowlands Trailer Cinematic with him and Sylvanus.
Here is a link to the cinematic on youtube right as his eyes change colors:
https://youtu.be/3lJWEqsd_Co?t=79

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88

Then where are all the DK’s with different color eyes?

It is.

89

Where are they?

The Helm of Domination. Bolvar was never a DK or raised by the LK. He chose to “sacrifice” himself to keep the scourge in check. And he never merged with the actual LK to be his vessel as Arthas did. Not to mention there was no Ner’zhul to merge with anymore because “reasons”.

90

Where are they?

Thassarian, The Black Knight, risen Drakkari Death Knights, the OG Horsemen, Alexei Barov, Death Knight Captains & Understudies in Naxxramas, Lady Alistra, the list goes on: – Blizzard has explicitly shown from both named Knights and generic ones that DK Eye Colors are not locked to the ones we see in-game.

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91

Oh yeah, Lord Thorval can go on the list too, as can Death Captain Detheca, Deathguard Captain Vandel, Luthion the Vile and Vanthryn the Merciless, generic Darkfallen Deathblades, I can continue.

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92

See, this is just people looking for stuff to fit their conclusion.

Thassarian has blue eyes. The Black Knight is wearing a helm, and has different forms which no other Death Knights have.

Risen Drakkari Death Knights clearly arent 3rd generation death knights and they are most likely not even death knights at all.

The OG Horsemen are 2nd generation DK’s.

Oh look, Alexi Barov has the same face scars / tattoos that dont have eye glows within the game just like Thassarian and Whitemane that both have blue eyes but its a game limitation which has been discussed for absolute years now.

Death Knight Captain, or really anything in Naxx since it was just taken straight from Vanilla, are 2nd generation DK’s.

Lady Alistra isnt a Dk.

No they havent.

Face scars that dont allow eye glow on the human models.

Has blue eye glow from what I found.

A regular forsaken with the Forsaken armor…

Why not include Teron Gorefiend?

A lot of these are just you hoping they are death knights that support your want, and the others are either 2nd gen or actually do have blue eye glow but are limited due to the game engine not allowing it due to another circumstance.

Like Whitemane, people would point at her just like they do with Thassarian because her eyes dont glow in game either. But they do glow in a cinematic where she is carrying Bolvar, and Thassarian eyes glow Blue as well because its in the comic.

Why didnt you use Falric and Marwyn? Are you just looking for things that have skulls on their armor and calling them DK’s? Or looking for things that say “Death” in the name somewhere and just saying “it has death in the name therefore it must be a death knight”?

This is just grasping at straws and embarrassing.

93

Thassarian has blue eyes. The Black Knight is wearing a helm, and has different forms which no other Death Knights have.

As for Thassarian, no he doesn’t: He has more often than not been depicted with normal eyes. The Black Knight does more often than not wear a helm, yes but when we finally saw him without it – he had normal eyes.

Risen Drakkari Death Knights clearly arent 3rd generation death knights and they are most likely not even death knights at all.

The Risen Drakkari Death Knights are most likely not even death knights despite using Death Knight abilities, even having a runeblade ON TOP of being literally called -Death Knights?- Wild.

The OG Horsemen are 2nd generation DK’s.

No they are not – the only similarity they have is that they were formerly paladins. The Second Generation pledged their loyalty to Ner’zhul, never actually “dying” in the sense of traditional Death Knights; they’re Arthas-lite. All of the OG Four were explicitly undead, and were made by Kel’thuzad to serve as his Elite Guard.

Oh look, Alexi Barov has the same face scars / tattoos that dont have eye glows within the game just like Thassarian and Whitemane that both have blue eyes but its a game limitation which has been discussed for absolute years now.

That’s because Alexi and Thassarian don’t have blue eyes, and the only reason Whitemane doesn’t is because Blizzard is simply lazy.

Death Knight Captain, or really anything in Naxx since it was just taken straight from Vanilla, are 2nd generation DK’s.

No, the second generation Death Knights were all Arthas-lite fallen paladins of the Silver Hand disenfranchised to the point they pledged loyalty to Ner’zhul and were granted vampiric runeblades.

Lady Alistra isnt a Dk.

Lady Alistra isn’t a Death Knight despite using Death Knight abilities? Wild.

Face scars that dont allow eye glow on the human models.

No, it’s because the blue eyes are not required for Death Knights.

Has blue eye glow from what I found.

I’m only seeing yellow eyes.

A regular forsaken with the Forsaken armor…

That uses death knight abilities.

Why not include Teron Gorefiend?

Because he’s not relevant to the discussion as we’re talking about DK eye-colors?

A lot of these are just you hoping they are death knights that support your want, and the others are either 2nd gen or actually do have blue eye glow but are limited due to the game engine not allowing it due to another circumstance.

No, these are all objective death knights that are not from the Second Generation, as none of them fit the description.

“Death Knights were once virtuous defenders of Humanity. However, once the Paladin ranks were disbanded by the failing Alliance, many of these holy warriors traveled to the quarantined lands to ease the suffering of those left within the plague-ridden colonies. Though the Paladins were immune to disease of any kind, they were persecuted by the general populace who believed that they had been infected by the foul plague. A small band of Paladins, embittered by society’s cruelty traveled north to find the plague’s source. These renegade Paladins succumbed to bitter hatred over the course of their grueling quest. When they finally reached Ner’zhul’s icy fortress in Northrend they had become dark and brooding. The Lich King offered them untold power in exchange for their services and loyalty. The weary, vengeful warriors accepted his dark pact, and although they retained their humanity, their twisted souls were bound to his evil will for all time. Bestowed with black, vampiric Runeblades and shadowy steeds, Death Knights serve as the Scourge’s mightiest generals.”

Like Whitemane, people would point at her just like they do with Thassarian because her eyes dont glow in game either. But they do glow in a cinematic where she is carrying Bolvar, and Thassarian eyes glow Blue as well because its in the comic.

Thassarian’s eyes don’t even glow blue in the comic, and as for Whitemane it’s because Blizzard’s simply just lazy.

Why didnt you use Falric and Marwyn? Are you just looking for things that have skulls on their armor and calling them DK’s? Or looking for things that say “Death” in the name somewhere and just saying “it has death in the name therefore it must be a death knight”?

I didn’t use Falric and Marwyn because I can’t see their eyes and no, I’m looking for Death Knights.

This is just grasping at straws and embarrassing.

You are just grasping at straws, I agree.

5 Likes
94

I am pretty sure I mentioned this previously all you need to do is go to Archeus and take a walk around looking at some of the various NPC Death Knights Acolytes and other Death Knight NPC’s throughout this location… because these NPC’s don’t all have BLUE EYES… they have various colors…theres your answer of where they are… just go LOOK…

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95

New hero spec “San’layn” won’t be able to use the red eyes, but every other blood elf void elf night elf, even a night elf druid can…ok

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96

Yes he does

Yes. They arent the LK Death Knights. Do LK death Knights have a terrify / fear? No they dont.

Yes they are.

Due to an in game limitation, this has been proven over and over again.

No, because its a game limitation with face scars / tattoos on the human model.

Gotta pick which one they were. Falric and Marwyn were most likely the 2nd and 3rd death knights being Arthas’ right and left hands… which generation were they?

So then Death Knights are Liches? Banshees? Scourge Wildlife? Death Knights use their abilities because only Liches can use DnD and only banshees can use AMS… thats what you are saying right?

For 3rd and 4th gen, they are.

Quit saying this, its embarrassing and not the slam dunk you think it is.

Hes a Death Knight though. I mean you are using people that arent death knights, trying to say having “Death Knight” is only 1 thing apparently… so he should be included.

No they arent, you want them to be a thing for your argument. Thats it.

Yes they do.

Game limitation. Again this was proven years ago and its not my fault you are late to the party spouting the same stuff as people back in BFA that were asking for other eye colors and Blizzard said no.

I did that years ago. Game limitations do not give you an argument.

Do people seriously not play the game or pay attention to stuff? San’layn do not have exclusively red eyes and they are a race. How a class can embody the fantasy of a race, i dont know, but they dont have red eyes outside of a few that you can find. BQL has black, BPC has yellow and purple, Blood Knights had blue and on and on.

Those red eyes on elves are Darkfallen, basically an option for an “undead” elf which is all that a Darkfallen is.

This gave would be so much better if people that actually cared made suggestions.

97

Yes he does

No, he doesn’t. They don’t glow blue in the comics, they don’t glow blue in the game…

Yes. They arent the LK Death Knights. Do LK death Knights have a terrify / fear? No they dont.

They aren’t LK DKS despite being called Death Knights, despite being in the service of a LK? Wild.

Yes they are.

No they’re not – I already posted the exact definition of just what the Second Generation were, and not one of the OG Horsemen fit the criteria.

Due to an in game limitation, this has been proven over and over again.

No it isn’t and no it hasn’t – Alexi and Thassarian were given the cultist skin without the blue eyes for a reason, that reason being they don’t have it.

No, because its a game limitation with face scars / tattoos on the human model.

No, it’s because Blizzard is lazy.

Gotta pick which one they were. Falric and Marwyn were most likely the 2nd and 3rd death knights being Arthas’ right and left hands… which generation were they?

Well let’s see. Process of Elimination be like…

Not Gul’dan raised, so they’re not first.
Not Ner’zhul converted, so they’re not second.
Arthas raised them, so they must be the Third!

So then Death Knights are Liches? Banshees? Scourge Wildlife? Death Knights use their abilities because only Liches can use DnD and only banshees can use AMS… thats what you are saying right?

No, I’m saying that Lady Alistra is a Death Knight because not only does she use death knight abilities she has this thing called a Runeblade. Funny innit?

For 3rd and 4th gen, they are.

No they’re not, for reasons I’ve already explained.

Hes a Death Knight though. I mean you are using people that arent death knights, trying to say having “Death Knight” is only 1 thing apparently… so he should be included.

No, I’m using the actual lore meaning I have no reason to use Teron Gorefiend, you’re the one that brought him up because you’re just using headcanon.

Yes they do.

No they don’t.

Game limitation. Again this was proven years ago and its not my fault you are late to the party spouting the same stuff as people back in BFA that were asking for other eye colors and Blizzard said no.

No, it’s not a game limitation it’s because Blizzard’s just lazy. Death Knights have had a variety of eye colors in the past, it’s not my fault you don’t know the lore.

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98

I think it’d suck to lose the innate affinity to the Lich King that spawned the entire class, just to make knock off vampires that are utterly unrelated.

But it’s just how things are going to be.
Get used to it or quit, basically.
The age of the lore fan is long dead.
BFA was its death knell.
Shadowlands was the spear to the gut.

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99

They do glow blue. The entire comic is in black and white aside from the cover. So use the thing that is in color. What color is his eyes?

Are 1st gen Death Knights the LK Death Knights? By your logic they must be because they are called Death Knights.

The OG horsemen are 2nd gen DKs.

If you claim they are given a skin for a reason, whitemane has that skin as well so she must have been given that skin for a reason too. But it’s been proven that eye glow doesn’t work on the faces with these face scars or tattoos. Not a single one has an eye glow but we know Whitemane has blue eyes, as also know Thassarian has blue eyes.

Whitemanes eyes aren’t blue because of an in game limitation. You have got to be trolling at this point.

Runeblades aren’t exclusive to death knights either. Have you played this game at all? Even the slightest? And paid attention to what was going on?

You haven’t explained anything. You grasp at straws saying I’d something is called a Death Knight then it’s a LK death knight which isn’t true. That if you have a runeblades you must be a DK like others can’t use them or something. You are just trolling at this point, you have absolutely nothing.

100

The San’layn were created by the LK. Just undead elves that are somewhat vampiric that doesn’t make sense as a hero spec for DKs.