Reading this thread title I had a feeling someone was gonna be seething.
I’m incredibly happy, I don’t even care if the content of shadowlands is/will be bad anymore. It’s like I’m home again.
13 Likes
I’ve said earlier and I’ll say it again: these changes do nothing to equalize the two choices. Players are saying that you might not get a group if your covenant choice isn’t the best for the content you’re doing; do you really think you’ll be allowed to stay in a group as 2H Frost when it’s 10% worse than DW, especially if DW Frost is middle of the pack? If you’re just playing casually that’s fine, but your opinion, ultimately, doesn’t matter then, because you won’t be doing content where this issue will arise.
If the second rank of KM, which makes Obliterate deal extra Frost damage, scales based off your AP and not the damage of the Obliterate, then these changes are much worse than I’m expecting.
There’s also not a single “2H” talent and talents shouldn’t be pushed toward one playstyle or the other anyways.
4 Likes
As i said before all resources in making 2 hander not complete shi***. Meanwhile core issues still persist. Congratz you did it!!! You got an aesthetical weapon choice that is not totally crap!!!
Please stop throwing around this baseless 10% number. Makes not sense to just continue repeating it. 1. It’s based on 2H not running razorice which itself isn’t given at all. 2. It’s only on the km procs themselves. Stop being salty and start having constructive dialogue instead…
30 Likes
OMG a problem still exists! That’s it, everybody stop trying to fix problems! If you can’t fix them all at once what’s the point?
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The question becomes does mastery crit haste with icecap for 2 hand become the go to spec for big single strikes and huge frost damage (with razorice) or does haste mastery dw become a better option.
On a raidboss razorice is a better choice than fallen crusader as it is 15% always on after enough hits on the boss vs FC uptime of 70-80% for the same 15%
Fighting mobs of course razorice would probably be weaker.
It is definitely something I would definitely like to see vs training dummies to see what the gap is. Also interested in the spike damage for pvp
The 10% number is not in terms of DPS, its in terms of what this change actually does. Its a 10% increase for KM obliterates for 2h over DW… a singular spell. If obliterate has a base damage of 100, then a KM obliterate for 2h would be 250, while DW would be 230… thats what people are making a big deal out of. Obliteration was probably going to be used by 2h anyways due to having less KM procs naturally, and for DW it all depends on what covenant you are running of what build you can go.
Its not a baseless number, its literally what this change is, 25% increase in obliterate damage over DW without KM, roughly 10% with KM. So even in Obliteration builds, 2h will be doing a small amount of damage more with Obliterate than DW, but DW will boost what triggers Obliteration as well as the KM proc itself by 15%. It triggers off of Frost Strike and Howling Blast which are both frost based spells.
No problem is being fixed here, Blizzard is taking the easy way out and how people are acting towards it shows why they did it. They do a small change like this, people go nuts over it thinking all is good in the land of Oz, then live hits and they find out that the witch is still alive and strong. It happened when 2h was announced, its happening right now, it happened with the new runeforges.
Does glacial advance become a must pick for 2h now?
Fallen Crusader is not 15% increased damage, its 15% more str which is why it has been the go to runeforge for pretty much all specs since ever. This stacks with pillar, deaths due, makes any str boost to your character just better. Not to mention that it boosts all damage and not just frost damage.
No, you still need the Razorice Runeforge for it to apply razorice. The tooltip is misleading but its trying to tell people that if you have razorice then it will apply it to mobs.
damn, that’s disappointing
Think of it as Frostscythe, except razorice needs to be present on the 2h, or one of the 1h weapons. Frostscythe needs it on the main hand though for it to apply Razorice.
GA could be an effective RP dump though in shadowlands which would be nice for AOE.
Keep in mind a numbers pass has not been done. They simply added MOTFW to show they are aware of the issue. Numbers are always changing up to weeks into the new raid.
A nice win for people who prefer 2h.
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I think that with the extra base damage that 2hand is already getting on Obliterate it might be viable. It is definitely something that needs to be matched out or checked ingame to see what the % difference is now and I also think might need to sim both weapon runes to see which one is better overall as I think 2hand will prioritise frost damage and have less on the physical side
Or you can just use frost strike which has synergy with conduits and it doesnt have a CD.
Because most of the damage of Frost is frost damage. The only physical damage is non KM obliterates and auto attacks. Either way you look at the scenario though is 2h has to figure out which is best, while DW gets the best of both worlds.
Its not like if 2h picks one or the other its going to be some great weapon option. Its a minor buff to non KM obliterate since you have to factor in armor, and with KM its really not that much damage to actually make a difference overall. They would have to buff it through the roof for it to really be any good. In WoD Might gave 35% melee damage and 50% obliterate damage and even then on certain fights early on DW was better and then it just scaled better as the expansion went on.
There really isnt much they can do with MotFW which is why people didnt want it back, it just creates more problems than it solves. Did people technically get what they wanted in terms of 2h? Sure, they got the option and obliterates that do hit harder, it just amounts to nothing.
1 Like
The other choice is 2handing with ridiculous attack speed to basically seem identical to DWing, basically it would be like you could transmog 2 one hands into a 2hand.
In the end to make 2handing work it needs to be a different style of hard hitting slow attacks which will be tough to balance and likely one will always be better at certain points
1 Like
A transmog option wouldnt have came with any mechanical issues. Not to mention that it would have taken your main hand attack speed for the swing timer which is only 1 sec less than the 2h base weapon speed.
And no, the best way to do it is to make it so weapons play no role in the spec. Fury is going DW to DW with gaining 1h weapons so it doesnt really matter, but 2h and DW in the same spec when its designed around auto attacks is just the wrong way of going about it. You base it off of abilities so the weapons end up being stat sticks.
2 Likes
Might of the frozen wastes is up on the PTR I might setup some testing to see how good it is
I think a 2H build with Koltira’s, Murderous Efficiency, and Obliteration sounds pretty fun and I’m looking blasting some juicy Obliterates with it.
3 Likes