Might of the Frozen Wastes is back

So you dont know what that 10% is, which is actually 8.33%. Its not dps, its damage difference between 2h KM obliterate and DW km obliterate (if KM rank 2 gets increased by Razorice). And a lot of people arent actually getting behind it. Preach said its the same gameplay since wrath which is true. Its barely changed at all so all this talk of “dw playstyle” is not dependent on the weapon. Wrath frost played the same no matter what weapon you used, in cata, it was the same no matter the weapon you used you just had to pick up Might or ToT, MoP and WoD had DW playstyle change from the norm, then Legion brought it back and it has continued to stay.

The entire point of Might was to address the runeforge disparity between the 2 weapons, the explanation is right there in the patch notes. There is a reason why Fallen Crusader is so good, its because you are able to stack it with other things. While it is a proc, it has a relatively high uptime due to it scaling with haste, its been like this for a LONG time, that with Pillar and your trinkets is why its far superior to Stoneskin. Its why Blood even uses Fallen Crusader. Razorice on the other hand only increases a single type of damage and why it was the secondary runeforge for a long time until Frostscythe came around. You didnt want to miss with your offhand and miss out on FC procs, but Razorice was going to stack anyways through abilities.

A bad idea is a bad idea, putting sprinkles on it doesnt all of a sudden make it a good idea. If there are inherent problems with it then thats all there is too it.

You can just look at the person in the next post after the one im responding to to see why I respond like I do. That 10% was not made up or inaccurate, they dont even know what I meant by 10% damage difference. The beta testers havent been testing properly, and assuming, and what are they testing on for the most part? Test dummies, because you cant do proper class testing in a raid. You cant reset what your doing and go again in a short amount of time, you can actually get a pretty good handle on what your class can do on a test dummy, thats why they are test dummies.

You can see that they are talking about dps difference which no one knows because there are still bugs. These people are just mad, want to say im against something when im for the spec. I could care less about what weapon there is, and as long as they both exist I dont want another WoD because frost was dumpster tier because of the balance issues. But someone is going to take that as me saying 2h was garbage tier instead of the spec was garbage tier. It was 20k behind other specs on a regular early on and later on even worse. It was battling itself more than anything which is not good game design.

So, would you like to take a stab at why Might shouldnt be 15% frost damage and the 25% obliterate damage be put into Obliteration? It would open the spec and choices instead of “if you have this weapon then you have to play this, and if you have this one you have to play this”. Sounds like you cant be flexible at all.

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So put Razorice as a passive of sorts baked into 2H? Not a bad idea, it certainly offsets the difference. And 2H Frost has been begging for their weapon to get innate frost damage for scaling for years, so it makes sense as a decision.

However I am afraid that when it comes into balancing that, that the DW side will complain about their “Mandatory Razorice Rune and why does 2H get it for free?” even if it is only the frost damage of Razorice and not the full runeforge.
Or that Might + Razorice becomes too strong and makes 2H pull ahead against DW. Because 30% increase would be pretty significant.

After testing dw and 2h frost on beta using obliteration for 2h + razorice and breath for dual weild + razorice and crusader i ended up finding 2h to be a bit better in most situations.

Dual weild oblit crits: 3300
2H oblit crits: 5350

There are still some bugs tho. I dont think the 10% haste runeforge is working atm and hyperthermic presence isnt either. Also our oblit leggo that refunds runes might not be working as i didnt notice ANY runes returning at all or oblit being free.

I thought we already had this conversation. This nukes 2h as a viable playstyle by giving DW all of its tools. The two need to be seperate, and as of right now, there’s the potential for both to be independently viable, without giving DW the only unique scaling tools 2h has.

90% sure Hypothermic is working, as of my dummy testing last tueday, but the 10% haste is an on kill trigger. It’s not a passive 10% haste, it’s an on kill buff.

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Ahhh so its basically useless in raid lol

Unless you can proc it reliably, multiple times a fight, yea. I wouldn’t say there’s no situation ever where you use it, but it’s very fight specific.

I feel like 2h frost is a little 1 dimensional and boring tbh.

Especially obliterstion spec

All yoir dmg is in oblit spam

Are you playing with Icy Talons? It’s completely dominant on the first tier and provides the moment to moment gameplay that the spec is missing at a baseline level. 2h KM has great synergy with it that outclasses Advance and Cold Heart.

Icy tal0ns doesnt change the core design of spam obliterate. It hits hard dont get me wrong but my MM hunter hits harder and feels more complex

I don’t agree with that at all, but that’s fine. IT has a pretty dramatic Killing Machine proc rate increase, and forces a pace where you can’t bank RP or Runes for Pillar windows, which would otherwise be the case. It’s the only talent in that row that actually meaningfully impacts the rotation on a minute by minute basis.

Banking for Pillar without breath isn’t exactly thrilling, and that’s what’s broadly necessary outside of Icy Talons.

It’s the weapon we deserve.

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My PRECIOOOOUS~!

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On the ptr or at 60?

I feel like the Frostmourne, as much as I would love the skin, is going to be a huge lore point in this expansion. I am guessing the Frostmourne is a mini Maw and The Jailer is going to want all his toys back :stuck_out_tongue:

At 60 on beta with legendaries and full soulbind and conduits active

They’re changing weapon drops to weapon tokens.

It really wouldn’t surprise me if there was a full round of class based legendary items, and we got Frostmourne as our definitive weapon for the Maw raid tier. Maybe if we’re lucky, Arthas himself will help us harness it.

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A real weapon for a real spec.

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They’re adding tokens for raids. I’d like to see them expand the token system to M+ keys as well.

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I feel like 2h frost is a little 1 dimensional and boring tbh.

Especially obliterstion spec

All yoir dmg is in oblit spam

Sometimes its the simple things in life that are the best. 2H Frost has a proven method of enjoyment as simple as that may look.

Obliteration as a talent adds enough spice where its optimal to weave in Howling Blast and Frost Strikes for KM procs.

Put simply, 2H Frost dealing big damage through Obliterate is literally what many of us enjoyed and have wanted for an age. No need to try and over complicate it!

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