Max level camping

[Astrogazer-wild-growth]

roll on a pvp server
pvp happens

surprised pikachu.jpg

[Twíggí-area-52]

I wish blizzard went back to “PvP problems require PvP solutions “

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

@Amideus, just because it’s new people doing the griefing, does not make spawn camping less of a griefing action.

Actually it by definition is. What you described is that you’re in an area of activity and trying to do something on a PVP server, and the other people AROUND you are killing you when you res. That’s not griefing, that’s PVP. REGARDLESS of your level or ability to fight back. Because “fair” is arbitrary.

[Cakè-caelestrasz]

I personally would consider giving someone a 2min respawn timer, then waiting around to kill them again, griefing. Where would you draw the line between PvP and griefing?

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Twíggí-area-52

I wish blizzard went back to “PvP problems require PvP solutions “

Actually that definition is FROM vanilla. That has always been their stance, and doesn’t change the PVP problems require PVP solutions argument. They aren’t mutually exclusive stances.

[Fingersniffr-living-flame]

been saying this since day 1, classic rez timers are terrible by design and do nothing but punish those who lose

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

I personally would consider giving someone a 2min respawn timer

This is a function of how often you are dying. Why do you keep dying in the exact same spot? Did you try spirit resurrection?

@Cakè-caelestrasz

then waiting around to kill them again, griefing.

But you JUST SAID that it’s different people. So which is it? Is it someone waiting around to kill you specifically over and over again and following you, or is it different people in the area killing you? You cannot have both. Being killed everytime you res in the same area by different people is not “waiting around to kill you on spawn”.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Where would you draw the line between PvP and griefing?

I already made a statement on this. The same person or group of people following and targeting you specifically and following you around for an extended period of time (a bit arbitrary). Killing the same important NPC on spawn for an extended period of time. Abusing gameplay to cause negative impacts to another player in a way that there is not a standard PVP solution. (Example, dragging additional mobs intentionally into another same faction player to get them killed.)

[Argentia-defias-pillager]

pvp on pvp server is not griefing

[Cakè-caelestrasz]

When the GY is being camped, there is no chance to spirit res or body res. Rogues have a gap closer while stealthed and the level difference make it delete from half health.

Again spawn camping people is griefing, it happened in one zone so I changed and it happened again. Are you saying that GY spawn camping enough times to give 2min timer isn’t griefing just because it’s new people? Is that not just 2 different people griefing? It’s not a case of one person following me between zones to camp, it’s a case of multiple players spawn camping in different locations and I’ve just entered a new killing ground.

Do you not consider spawn/GY camping lowbies as griefing?

[Argentia-defias-pillager]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Again spawn camping people is griefing

on a pvp server? no it is not
this is what you signed up for

[Cakè-caelestrasz]

PvP is not “spawn camping players 10 levels lower than yourself”

I don’t understand how so many people are still stuck on this concept.

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

When the GY is being camped, there is no chance to spirit res or body res.

Look, I am not trying to say you are being disingenuous or lying, but there is a WHOLE lot of information being left out here if you are SPIRIT RESSURECTING and even the GY area in a completely different part of your region is being camped. Something isn’t adding up here for your story.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Rogues have a gap closer while stealthed and the level difference make it delete from half health.

Ok what level difference are we talking about? Are you 25 and they are 40? Are you 40 and they are 50? Because you can still be worth honor to them. And at that point it is absolutely PVP. ALSO didn’t you say it was different people? Why are we singling out classes now about this situation where it has nothing to do with the argument. Again, your story does NOT add up.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Again spawn camping people is griefing, it happened in one zone so I changed and it happened again.

Then that’s not spawn camping.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Do you not consider spawn/GY camping lowbies as griefing?

I do not consider killing a lower level flagged player griefing and I already explained this. Yu can be mad all you want, your fault for choosing the server you did.

Let me give you a lot of additional scenarios about why your whining and complaining is grating on me and makes no sense, because you don’t seem to get it.

What if I am a high level player and I want to farm some lower level mats for crafting professions? Am I supposed to just follow around every low level player and wait for them to pick or mine something before I kill them? Who is supposed to enforce that?

What if I am doing lower level quests for gold, specific item rewards, or just for fun? Do I have to tolerate lower level players around me stealing tags and doing the quests too instead of killing them? Why?

If I need a rare spawn or NPC, do I have to check with the lowbies to make sure it’s ok? Who is enforcing these arbitrary standards of PVP engagement?

The simple fact of the matter is:

If you are on a PVP server, in a contested zone, or a hostile zone, and another player kills you, that’s not griefing, that is PVP on a PVP server. I don’t care if you’re level 1 in broken gear and the player that killed you is 60 in Naxx bis. PVP happened on a PVP server.

If a specific player/group of players is making a concerted effort to kill you, THAT’S griefing depending on how long they do it and how far they follow you. Especially if they are targeting you and ignoring others.

[Argentia-defias-pillager]

@Amideus-dunemaul

if you continuously kill the same player over and over again following them for an extended period of time

only way you’ll get banned for this is if the player is a popular streamer lol

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

PvP is not “spawn camping players 10 levels lower than yourself”

Players 10 levels lower than you give honor. So, yes it is.

[Depressíng-earthfury]

@Partyhard-living-flame

I mean, that’s just because layers blow. A single layer for incursions would be pretty sick, honestly.

@Amideus-dunemaul

No it wouldn’t. It would be every patch day STV. You would lag so hard you couldn’t even fight, and there would be no mobs for you to even touch. There is a reason layers exist.

Or get rid of layers entirely, and bring realm populations back down to a reasonable number that works for a layerless server.

Open new realms. Set queues to appear if the population is higher than what 1 layer can handle, and offer free transfers off. Throwback to what the devs said 2 years ago:

@Aggrend-1483

When these mega-realms started to emerge last year, we were concerned about their impact, but we were very hesitant to take heavy-handed action for fear of breaking up friend groups and restricting player freedom. At this point however, we believe the time has come to end the concept of a mega-realm.

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Argentia-defias-pillager

only way you’ll get banned for this is if the player is a popular streamer lol

That’s actually not true. We used to have a lot of Alliance griefers on Anathema back in era. People sitting at flight paths like Felwood and mind controlling the players that landed and throwing them off the ledge, using rogues to keep them cc’d so they couldn’t fight back or run away.

We got them reported and a GM told them to move along and stop doing it. This DOES happen. it’s just far less likely these days because the days of active GMs is dead and gone.

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Depressíng-earthfury

Or get rid of layers entirely, and bring realm populations back down to a reasonable number that works for a layerless server.

You’d have to increase server infrastructure and a lot of other aspects that go into it. Blizzard is still a business, and we have no idea what the cost to benefit ratio is for these servers. And if you keep pop caps too low, what happens when a server starts dying out? When do mergers happen? How do you manage that? You want an idea of what that looks like, ask CS how they feel about it.

People always give these hand wave solutions without realizing just how insanely impossible the situation really is. There is a reason they don’t do server management like they did in 2004.

@Depressíng-earthfury

Throwback to what the devs said 2 years ago

A mega realm would be several layers, not just layers in general. I think the streamer servers had something like the same guild spread across like 10 versions of a guild or something. That’s not remotely the same thing.

[Zachaios-malganis (Zachaios)]

These threads crack me up.

If you can’t take the heat, then get out of the kitchen.

I was being camped earlier today and called in a few buddies who then proceeded to camp the campers.

PvP solution to a PvP problem.

Low levels or otherwise. You chose to play on a PLAYER vs PLAYER server. Period.

Stick to the starting zones if you don’t want to be “griefed” or go play on a PVE server.

This isn’t rocket science.

[Cakè-caelestrasz]

Your whatboutscenarios are not the same as spawn camping a player. If you were doing low level content you’d blitz through it before it became camping. None of your examples include repeatedly killing a player immediately upon respawn.

For full info, I died between rebel camp and Kurzen. I body ressed, died immediately, twice. So I took res sickness at the GY, stealthed and started toward Rebel camp, same rogue got me. Waited the two minutes and took res sickness to hearth, same rogue got me again.

Again we come back to the line between PvP and Griefing.

I’m 37, so I’m not worth honour to 50s.

It’s okay I’ll just start reporting them in game for gameplay sabotage and leave the result, either agreeing or disagreeing with me, up to Blizz.

@Zahaios, at least you’ve acknowledged that it’s griefing.

[Amideus-dunemaul]

@Cakè-caelestrasz

Your whatboutscenarios are not the same as spawn camping a player. If you were doing low level content you’d blitz through it before it became camping. None of your examples include repeatedly killing a player immediately upon respawn.

But again you said it was DIFFERENT PEOPLE doing it. So again which is it? You’re just lying about it at this point and it’s getting frustrating.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

For full info, I died between rebel camp and Kurzen.

Oh so someone taught you about STV I see.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

I body ressed, died immediately, twice. So I took res sickness at the GY, stealthed and started toward Rebel camp, same rogue got me.

So wait wait wait. Let me get this straight. You died in a place, and instead of trying to leave that place, you kept going BACK? This is ABSOLTUELY A YOU PROBLEM! You have no idea what we’re talking about. You take a spirit res, you don’t GO BACK TO WHERE YOU DIED. You use the spirit res to LEAVE the area.

@Cakè-caelestrasz

It’s okay I’ll just start reporting them in game for gameplay sabotage and leave the result, either agreeing or disagreeing with me, up to Blizz.

That should have always been your solution, but just know that’s not considered griefing. You had every opportunity to leave that area. You could have corpse hopped away resurrecting further and continuing to run forward into STV or back into Duskwood.