The bitter truth. Especially in regards to this forum.
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Not really, they will just say that Sylvanas tried to save everyone (or I guess the Horde) and that’s why she isn’t evil.
Anyone with half of a brain will realize that she is still evil and that ends don’t justify the means, but the writers are lacking that.
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All the arguments about how sylvanas was the truest horde character cause she killed alliance and how thrall betrayed the horde for working with jaina
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And the treatment of Baine- a hero who literally saved the Horde from itself. Remember all those hate and shame threads about him?
Despicable treatment from the supposed “true Horde fans”.
It’s ALWAYS been such a pity party with them. I guess that’s why most of them play Forsaken and blood elves.
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Remember when some Blood Elf players quit the game because they found out Void Elves are getting fair skin tones? This just shows you the level of pettiness of certain Horde players. It has nothing to do with wanting a “good story” because to them a “good story” is just whatever makes Alliance players mad and if the story doesn’t make Alliance players mad then it makes Horde players sad.
Example Baine wanting to work towards achieving peace between both factions generally doesn’t make many Alliance players mad so thus it makes Horde players sad. Sylvanas doing genocide upon an entire Alliance race makes Alliance players mad, so that is why Sylvanas became the favorite character among many Horde players in BfA because what makes Alliance players mad is the only good part in the story. That’s all it is. Half of them weren’t even hardcore Sylvanas stans pre-BfA.
In short the ebb and flow of WoW story and for those who consume it goes like this : If it doesn’t make Alliance players mad then it makes Horde players sad.
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Honestly, the only issues I have with Baine is that there was an established darker side of his in War Crimes that we’ve never been allowed to see. Despite him apparently accepting it as a part of himself. Its also super hard to ignore that functionally, Baine’s own characterization comes second to his need to serve as a token-good Horde plot device; especially in instances where Blizz wants to go completely off the deepend with another Horde leader. Its detrimental character use.
In general, I like that he’s peace oriented, but there isn’t much nuance in how that is portrayed. I get that his turning Derek into an Olive Branch for Jaina may have been the tipping point to get her to agree with Anduin that there are parts of the Horde that might be worth saving. However, it would be nice if Baine was allowed to take decisive actions “For the Horde” … in instances that don’t always coincide with benefiting the Alliance. He lacks these moments.
That being said, at least Baine is is not Calia, in that he does at least represent at least a reasonable amount of the Tauren Culture and Racial Fantasy. Calia in contrast only represents who and what the Forsaken were prior to their deaths (and her abandonment of them) 15-16 years ago. Which is why this character desperately needs a counterbalance to represent what the Forsaken currently are … if she is really being built up as a future leader. Voss “could” do that fairly well.
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Weird of you to complain about it when you and Spuddyc circle like each other’s posts constantly.
Looks at all the Alliance posts bemoaning the status of Night Elves, no High Elves, and being impotent.
Both sides constantly complain and think they’re uniquely bad.
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Saving the world is always gonna benefit the alliance, and thats the problem with horde players
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Like you Hordeposters don’t?
These have always been legitimate gripes because Blizzard actively bullies an entire race and faction, and have even admitted to their biases a few times in the past.
When was the last time the night elves got a kickass Silverpine or Hillsbrad storyline, a visual victory like in Andorhal or having their leaders shown as competent badasses like Sylvanas in her cinematics?
I’ll wait.
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This will end up in a mutual weighing of “who has it worse”.
No, they don’t compare. The Horde has gripes with how they are written- that can be fixed. The night elves are literally being written into extinction. How can that be fixed without some sort of retconning?
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I don’t notice most likes, I don’t follow people around liking specific people. But hard not to notice Trivel and Spuddyc do.
Most people have legitimate gripes. The trap is thinking us versus them is productive. Instead of accepting we all have issues, people would rather de-legitimize the other side while saying they have it worse. Evident in that you ignored the point that ‘both sides think they have it uniquely bad’ to complain how you think you have it bad.
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Cause alot of times, the suggestions to fix the issues is to put down the other faction
and I do call out nelf players who want to genocide the horde
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See my above post and you can see how these issues don’t compare.
Don’t get me wrong, I understand how a few bad apples can spoil the bunch. Because there are posters on both sides that also just make bad arguments in general. Which in turn can fuel animosity.
You’re literally doing it, though. By saying they don’t compare, you are specifically trying to de-legitimize the other side’s complaints and say you have it uniquely bad. That’s just proving my point.
You can think ‘but I’m right’, doesn’t mean you aren’t doing it. And everyone thinks they’re right in these instances. All these issues are subjective evaluations on what matters to them or what they think is good writing.
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I mean, welcome to the club?
Seriously, nearly every damned PC race in the game has gone through near extinction level events in the last 36 years. Hell, the NEs aren’t even the only ones in WoW that have had those near misses. Goblins (with the destruction of Kezan), Gilneans (with the blighting of Gilneas), and the AU Mag’har (with the Light Crusade of Yrel) all took massive hits here. They NEs truly aren’t special in this regards. Just the most recent (and not even that, the AU Mag’har are).
Also, population amounts never mattered. The NEs didn’t lose a single character that might effect them negatively for future storytelling, with how hero-centric this game’s story really is. As victimized as the NE players feel they are, frankly speaking they aren’t in any risk of running out of stories, or becoming irrelevant any time soon.
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Your not wrong, my biggest issue lately anyways is everyone wants to fix the story right? Most horde players say they want too be seen the heroes again, but they are rejecting the hero stories that are being set up in shadowlands, like Thrall going to hunt sylvanas for tyrande. Alliance characters are heroes cause they help everyone, yet the horde want the horde to only ever help the horde.
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Yeah, it isn’t a mindset I can understand or appreciate.
As a primarily Alliance player, I never had an issue working with Horde characters. Because I see overcoming hatred as a big part of a lot of these stories, breaking the cycle of hatred.
I can see issues with how the presentation might roll out, problems there (like if they don’t want to be shamed as well). However, given the current situation, moving past just working with the other side to a certain extent seems like the best solution.
Because you rarely ever have to work with Horde characters. Or at least, not exclusively with them without someone of note from the Alliance also being there. The Horde PC has to work for exclusively Alliance heavy lore characters shockingly often. And, tbh, even then, its not that we have to work with them that is the problem in of itself. Its the harsh reality that because (like with Legion) the Alliance roster is dominating these stories, it leaves very little room for our absolutely decimated roster of characters to get TLC and development.
The Horde has gone through the ringer twice of being hit with the villain bat, culling our roster more and more. A roster we need to feel relevant in future stories with how truly hero-centric Blizz is when writing WoW. In both cases these immensely destructive Villain Bat expansion were followed by “run off to another dimension” expansion that nearly avoid the consequences of the prior expansion entirely. Which is perhaps why Legion was such a sore spot, since it truly the entire Horde faction could have been written out … and you would have only had to change Surumar.
Blizz has proven themselves to have an absolutely horrific track record on wanting to put in the leg-work an repair what they’ve broken on the Horde. Or build up replacements for the roster they’ve gutted. So, truly, at its core (at least for me) what working so heavily under (and with) Alliance reps so overwhelmingly perhaps has simply become synonymous with that extreme neglect shown by Blizz over the years.
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Horde npc #1: I’m tired of our heroes dying.
Horde npc #2: That’s what makes them heroes.
::He would look at the entire Alliance cast.::
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