Chrono isn’t an issue.
at 10% not really
the 25% and 50% iterations (iirc) were absolutely stupid
1 Like
I’d argue the undispellable, spammable slow is much more of an issue than the speed boost ever was.
1 Like
is there a spec in the game that doesn’t have a 50% slow?
is that not just a worse frost shock in a lot of contexts?
sure it’s easier to apply than hamstring or disable but what comp is an arcane mage playing where there isn’t already a spammable 50% slow in the mix
the movement speed is the only thing really unique or, at least 95% of the time beneficial
1 Like
It’s a 50% snare with nearly 100% uptime because Barrage is a core rotational ability that can’t be dispelled, I don’t think there’s any other spec with that, even Chilled for Frost can be dispelled.
That snare was always the reason Arcane couldn’t be touched, it can only be touched now because they made the spec’s baseline move speed slower than a freshly created level 1 character on Classic as well as 10% reduced benefit from all speed increases.
useful yeah
the reason arcane couldn’t be touched?
i don’t know where you’re playing that 50% snares have less than 99% uptime but significantly worse-to-apply snares sit nearly 100% uptime
the original speed boost and displacement beacon are reasons arcane can’t be touched
they could lose that snare entirely and hardly notice a difference in any meaningful group content
It has a 25% speed boost that can have extremely high uptime with Master Shepherd but no one plays it over Chrono right now because the perma AoE snare is just way more valuable.
Let’s be real though, the issue with Chrono Shift arose once Arcane moved to having extremely easy access to Arcane Charge generation and the 3 sec cooldown on Barrage removed mid-Dragonflight.
It used to be a tradeoff on your damage to maintain Chrono in ages past because it was slower to regen Charges which limited the damage potential for Arcane and made Missile spam more favourable for damage over Blast.
you’re trolling
Hilarious bc mage is the most busted class on the beta rn LOL every spec 100-0 You in .1 with instants
I think this is a direct consequence of all the pruning, though.
Yes, there will obviously be tuning for every single spec.
However, with literally dozens of utility tools/abilities/rotational buttons being purged from classes, the tuning IS going to need to be harsher OR damage AND healing will need to drop significantly.
Pvp is a MUCH harder tuning problem to solve than PVE (as we see every single season) because it’s not a static environment, classes cant turtle, health pools are significantly smaller for players than bosses, and players NEED to die for the game mode to function.
Blizzard balance and tuning isn’t as bad as a lot of people make it out to be and I know that a new expansion is always a journey to reach proper tuning, but I worry significantly that having so many fewer knobs to tune will make pvp “balance” worse than ever.
Good take.
I will say as someone who plays mage, druid, and hunter. Druid’s somehow got more it feels like.. at least resto and balance. Mage literally has a better rotation and design for frost. They actually got the ability to get both ice nova + ring of frost at the same time because they aren’t on the same decision node.
Hunter and Shadow priest in comparison got gigga gutted IMO losing actual core abilities they have had for 15+ years.
It’s just funny to me after playing the beta seeing how mages barely lost anything and are still complaining
1 Like
- Yes, but if you take Ice Nova, you lose Cone of Cold. A key ability used in kiting.
- As for the better rotation, it doesn’t feel right at all:
- Glacial Spike is a forced cast, can’t bank empowerments.
- Blizzard is a target cast, not an area cast.
- Ray of Frost is our main cool down, replacing Icy Veins (core ability since Classic) – and it can be out-ranged, silenced, kicked, stunned, and completely shut-down.
- Comet Storm can ONLY be cast when you have a “proc” for it, replacing Blizzard (bizzare) and only AFTER casting Ray of Frost and it is its own talent too – the heck?
- Lost Ice Block Heal, Displacement heal.
- Losing slow to create distance as fire or even arcane
- Did you happen to see the image I posted earlier? It breaks down utility and dps buttons lost and mages have one of the most, so I am unsure where you’re getting that they “barely lost anything”. When that is just factually untrue. Making a different argument that their loss brings them on par is another take though.
Not trying to come off as combative, forgive me if that is what it sounds like. Cheers
I can count on one hand the number of times I actually see someone use cone of cold.
Its almost nonexistent in the current gamestate.
I think a LOT of pvers like the new rotation.
Sure, but they did the same thing with shadow crash and earthquake and people loved those changes, although having a choice for niche scenarios is obviously preferable!
The same is true of veins as a cd, though.
Frost mage needed some adjusting for sure because it had SO many “priority” mechanics/abilities that would change depending on tuning and sometimes even stat weights.
You had: flurry procs, instant ffbs, Lance procs, ray, glacial spike, veins, and commetstorm which were all high-impact light-up abilities.
Frost mage needed more of a redesign than MOST specs IMO.
Extremely minor; really only ever saw limited usage in solo play. Not to disparage people who enjoy those modes, but it’s pretty inconsequential in the scope of the game.
This is actually a good change, though. I think we need a little less homogeneity between classes.
To be clear, mage DID lose a lot; fire especially I think wouldve been a much better example to use here. Frost got a rework, but I think most of those changes are for the better, whereas fire mage is turning into a fireball casting turret LMAO.
Icy veins wasn’t added till tbc fyi.
1 Like
The people here thinking mages losing all those tools will be unviable are crazy.
If mages only defensive becomes alter and barrier them those will be giga stromg. Having less variables to balance is worse not better. Enjoy
Not crazy. Just concern. I’m sure you can relate. Change is scary after all lol….
Theres 2 blizzards 1 is on your target and 1 is on the ground maybe look at your talents first.
Ready above this guy actually has no idea what hes talking about considering its the exact same as shadow crash and earthquake that it has the node on the tree where 1 is target and 1 is ground targetted.
If it isnt kicked you just kill someone with it atm, so if you play with legit any class or use a nova on any melee you basically kill them, most classes cant stop a nova blink ray more then once.
Comet storm has been made into a aoe ability that does a small amount of damage, the other side of the tree makes frostfire bolt hit for 20-25ks atm level 80 with people having max 150k.
Distance can still be created by nova/ring blinks and your friends your playing with quite easily for a mage, if boomys can do it with only travel form then im sure mages can do it with several more thigns to use.
Mages actually dying to things other them MM hunter will be nice.
1 Like
Even wigh how strong mages were no class/spec deserves the midnight redesign.
Idc if they were op or not. The direction they are taking the game is god awful
1 Like
Maybe the game will finally be easy enough for you to do well!
1 Like
But they added a new cone of cold talent to make it even strong, it will root for 5 seconds and slow for 70-80% after the root ends…
You can cancel macro the glacial buff and cast frostbolt. More agency and some extra skill ceiling for ya.
You can still area cast, it is a choice node to target or area cast
Yes, this spell does require setup/coordination, IMO how mage spells should work. (This spell is insane if you tested it on beta btw you can shimmer behind a pillar)
The losses are nowhere NEAR on par with what some other classes lost. I think mage got away with a slap on the wrist in combination with a top tier frost re-work.