M+ revamp fixes

Community General Discussion
1

Here is an idea that I think would fix M+. By fix , I mean it would remove the meta , make people less willing to leave keys , and overall increase the amount of people playing M+.

1: Remove dungeon specific keys . Make keys just a level . Ex: +2, +3 etc not tied to specific dungeon

2: make every level of key queable like H dungeon group finder . This eliminates many issues such as :

      1:  you know longer have to sit in que for hours to hopefully get invited .  The game will automatically put you in a group like it would for H and N dungeons etc (LFR)

    2:  It destroys the meta. Every single season, classes and specs get left out for the meta .  By being able to que for keys mentioned above , it removes the meta and gives more gameplay chances for every class and spec .

How keys will work with this is simple :

Add key levels to the dungeon finder. If you have a +10 you can que for +10s and lower. You cannot que for higher .

Change keys to make them party wide. So now when you que in for a key level . Everyone in the party has that same key level . (Dungeon is no longer player specific). If you time the key, everyone’s key level goes up. If you don’t everyone’s key in the group goes down a level .

Over time , yes you will reach a wall because you don’t know who you will end up with . Blizz can still have premade 5 mans que for keys but everyone’s key in the party must be the level they are quing for .

Also , doing it this way will make people wanna finish keys out because it affects them as much as the current key holder . The meta no longer controls the game . Sure you might end up in a key with bad players but let the game randomize that . Currently players do that themselves . You wait in que till you see a good geared , high io player and for whatever reason that player turns out not to be good . This way it’s no longer on you to decide who comes and goes .

It will motivate people to play better and get better in order to be able to Que up for higher keys etc .

2

Unless it involves banning math or making every class identical, it doesn’t do this.

Queued content is designed around 100% success rate, and quite frankly this community sometimes overcomes that design intent. Coupled with composition importance and the fact no tank or healer would be in this queue, it’s not fixing anything.

That sounds utterly awful. If I want to run a lower key, it shouldn’t automatically deplete mine 3 times to join someone else’s group. It’s a creative attempt to get around the issue of whose key is used, but it’s honestly just not good.

2 Likes
3

If your current key is a +12 let’s just say , you can que for a plus +10 if u just wanna do vault. Your 12 won’t get depleted in a key lower then yours .

And it won’t fix the meta issue because now players can’t pick and chose what classes are coming . the game is gunna randomly que you into a group like it does for H dungeons etc or LFR

4

Wouldn’t that mean people would just find the easiest/quickest to run and ignore the rest of the dungeons?

And watch all of the groups fall apart, because no one has the utility they need for specific affixes or dungeons?

Which will be immediately in a 2.

I somehow doubt that.

The meta doesn’t control the game now.

1 Like
5

That’s slightly less bad, but it is a major incentive for me to literally never use the queue system as a tank or healer, when tanks and healers are heavily incentivized to never use this system out of the gate. Also, there’s a reason that LFR and Heroics are able to be done as random queue: They are trivial content with extra buffs just in case, and they will still farm people if there are any mechanics that can’t be ignored.

1 Like
6

Everything you listed is an easy fix , affixes can be designed around this etc . Like affixes shouldnt be designed around making certain classes utterly useless .

7

Any queue system shouldn’t restrict dungeon design. If dungeon mechanics have to be simplified or homogenized to accommodate the queue, the queue is a bad idea.

2 Likes
8

Yep. I’m out. lol

9

Dungeon design isn’t the problem. Blizzard doesn’t design dungeons around that , it’s the affixes that make certain classes useless

10

Which affixes are making what classes useless?

11

I’m saying in general . Affixes currently arnt doing that but in the past they have . last expansion there was an affix that made warriors utterly useless for the week lol.

Blizz can fix designs and design around random M+ finder ques . By giving M+ a group finder that isn’t chosen by key holders or extended the M+ market to a much bigger and wider player base .

12

Then it’s not a problem that needs solving.

They could, by making the content extremely easy. Because for them to make content work without need for any thought put into group composition or communication with other players, to say nothing about actually being able to play their characters well, they would need to water down difficulty until it is trivial, which is just heroics with an extra (ignorable) mechanic.

M+ and Normal-Mythic raiding wasn’t designed for random queue groups. There is content for those groups already without taking away from harder content. If you want people to support a queue for this, it needs to come with the following concessions:

  • Nothing that makes the queue easier. No random grouping buffs, no backfilling if the group dissolves
  • Dungeon design and tuning is based off premade groups, not randoms.
  • No complaining about groups failing the content.
13

People gunna complain no matter what lol so scratch that .

And I’m not saying for them to make the dungeons easier . By making a random Que finder for keys etc , the key then becomes based off skill of people for completion . You get into a key with specs not the best suited to handle that specific dungeon. that does not mean the key is done , it just means you gotta rely on your skill now to complete it because u can’t cheese it

14

You’ve asked them to make the dungeons easier in this thread by designing around the assumption of random composition. That’s limiting design and taking away mechanics that can exist.

15

Not at all . Blizzard has never designed dungeons around certain comps and I’m not saying they should start.

Having you Que into a premade group etc into a dungeon that lets just say gets easier if you have a rogue or a warlock but you don’t simply makes the group have to rely on their skills now to complete it .

No said anything about them designing dungeons to be easier

16

Just because you didn’t say the word “easier” doesn’t change that the mechanics being limited to accommodate this would make the dungeons easier.

17

Bro no one is saying or Implying that they should design dungeons easier ? You keep saying that I’m implying that but I’m not lol

18

No, composition is important.

1 Like
19

Composition is trivial and removes skill. Real skill is being able to beat something with off - meta comps . If you get into a key with classes not best equipped to handle certain things , then let your skills handle it .

20

Well of course, I don’t disagree with you on that. But this takes away player agency and especially those who prefer a certain comp.

Edit: and I never found meta to be an issue up to 10s