So, you’re saying people can kill it prenerf week 1, while making all the strats and undergeared without all the huge nerfs?
Doesn’t sound too bad
Also to add, only 2 bosses ever in the RWF took over 500 tries
Also most of those tries are testing things out making the strats
Mythic keys should just be a side novelty you do for titles. Running gear progression through it is not a good design. Not unless delves produce the same gear.
i dont know what kind of market psychoanalysts blizzard has on their team, but i don’t think they are very good.
if they were good, they would understand that people will stay subbed and play more if the game is fun to play.
i played the most i’ve ever played in DF because i could get all my gear from the raid on heroic - i just did a quick heroic raid once a week and then i was free to play the game and enjoy it.
i geared my main very quickly played lots of mythic plus and had lots of fun… so much fun that i actually geared two other characters… thats ALOT of mythic plus…
how much will i play in war within? not even sure i’m going to play it at all.
i’m going to have to do the raid on mythic to be competitive in mythic plus and mythic raiding is not just a chore that i don’t enjoy - it’s a huge inconvenience and a HUGE time commitment…
if i commit to raiding, i am basically saying to myself that i can never leave my house on tuesday and thursday evenings - no outings with coworkers after work on tues/thurs, no meeting with friends after work on tues/thurs, no going to the gym on tues/thurs after work: these are two whole days of a seven day week where i will be glued to my computer and unable to interact with anyone else in my real life, which i doubt that i want to do.
so blizzard made these changes to get people to play more but it actually has the complete opposite effect: many people will just unsub and stop playing before the season even starts.
really? good progress! keep your voices heard and they’ll change the rest of it too, great to hear that 
First kills are only 4-6 item levels below max. The days of “undergeared” first clears died a long time ago.
Ironically the changes being proposed actually leans back in that direction.
We are also talking 16 hour days for 2-3 weeks, or more raid time than guilds will spend the entire tier.
All because it’s easy lol.
Delves can’t give mythic track which is a shame.
mythic plus has atleast ten times the amount of mechanics that each mythic raid encounter has
also, mythic plus dungeons require full focus for 35-40 minutes at a time without stopping - this requires much more mental fortitude than a mythic raid encounter which usually never lasts more than 6-7 minutes.
it is a shame, i say put myth track gear at the end of each delve you clear - not just in the great vault
the great equalizer in clearing high end content should be actual skill, not ilvl.
let everyone compete on the same page, don’t give some people a leg up because they choose to enter the mythic raid.
Aww man…
That’s undergeared + huge nerfs for normal people
Which are not spent doing prog
You’re coping hard, you have been inaccurate on every point you made
Change was reversed seems like excessive grinding is back off the menu.
if by “hard” you mean “doing it undergeared” then sure.
They reverted the nerf anyway.
They are like 5 item levels below max, hardly super “undergeared.”
And hundreds and hundreds of max geaded players still take hundreds of tries.
The revert was to hero track and has nothing to do with what most people were talking about so…
Wait till he hears about how many sub 5% wipes happen in RWF 
nerfing welfare mythic+ gear was a bad idea. gonna see over a million “I QUIT” threads in the coming weeks, now that they have to clear actual challenging content for max ilvl lewts. lol.
and i quit my mythic raiding guild in season 2 of dragonflight. opps.
That’s of course probably very true…
But one thing they probably have unquestionable evidence in massive amounts of, we are very likely to unsub once we reach our goals. As much as we all like to complain about grinds and FOMO, if you could get everything you wanted within a week of an expansion launching, most of us would be unsubed in the first month.
This is a better take for it’s far easier to jump into a 10 or higher with 4 other good people then get 19 other people to do a few mythic bosses though results are often similar it just takes considerably longer with raiding.
It kind of depends because coordination is small scaled where in raiding it can be happening simultaneously
There are fights where you have to chain interrupts(near perfectly at least) and use multiple levels of CC and defensives but really it’s the coordination that happens on another level.
If you’re looking at overall number you can say that but the difference is the overwhelming majority of them is very simple and can be quickly put into auto-pilot by a good group.
But you can brick it and still get the reward or try again with another group or another group until you get it in the same week if you desire. Doing that in a mythic raid is next to impossible due to the unique Raid ID but that is a slightly different issue though.
it’s just often people think they lose something, but instead it’s just a bonus.
Terrible changes. Blizzard is just wasting the good faith they built up this expansion and a good reminder that they’re not making this game for their players.
The terrible vault RNG is going to hurt M+ players even more and now you can feel extra bad for missing a week. You can forget about any alts that you want to play seriously too.
It’s not a bonus… Things will be tuned accordingly, power from gear is relative to the content you’re doing.
Yes, +10 is tested with 613 ilvl on beta, that’s 26 ilvl below max mythic and 13 ilvl below entry mythic ilvl, experienced players will probably time +10 with 600 ilvl gear, which drops from end of run +4 chest.