For what? I don’t do group content either and the 379 stuff from the AH is good enough for old content.
id like to occasionally be able to join group content when I want.
I dont have the gear yet to do the megadungeon, i get declined to raids. the new events are helping gear up slowly, but PUGging is miserable, not necessarily the wiping and random people, but just how long it takes to even form the group. sitting in town waiting for people to join is the worst experience in a game that I can think of and THAT is unfortunately the best way to gear up. unless you have a static or a bunch of friends / guildies you sit in the group finder tool and wait. it needs improvements.
Why do dungeons have to be relevant for an entire expansion for main characters? Why don’t you view raids in the same light? I never understood this mindset that certain pieces of content have to have this treadmill in WoW. Good RPGs don’t have you just repeat the same content over and over again.
It is a key component at keeping people running on a dumb treadmill in order to pad MAUs. A system ripped right out of D3, basically allowing Blizzard to get more engagement on a smaller amount of content.
I know a lot of you guys love M+, but I personally think it was one of the worst systems I have ever seen put into a MMORPG. I think it is healthy for a game to have content to reach a completion point, this idea that people need to run the same content over and over again in order to stay entertained just causes massive burnout.
Edit: The reality is, Blizzard hasn’t really been able to keep up with meaningful content updates for some time now. People keep raving about the content updates in DF, but the content being added is like stuff that is kind of completing the expansion. DF shipped in a rather bare bones state in my opinion. I think a lot of the stuff being added was planned for the expansion launch.
Blizzard has been relying on recycled content to carry the game now since Legion. I think the game was just better when people completed the content and their character could be done with the patch expansion allowing them to play alts or other games.
9 Likes
And look how quickly they all became obsolete. At least m+ keeps dungeons relevant for the life of the expansion. Who cares if they add a few dungeons if you’re only going to run them once for a quest and never step foot in there again.
You mean the dungeons that were entirely irrelevant after getting basic gear because they didn’t scale up like m+ does? No thanks. I love running dungeins so I’ll take the version where I can keep doing so for the entire expansion and still have gear progression.
So the game was better when you’d finish the limited content and quit to play another game. Okay then.
4 Likes
I disagree
What if I just want to consistently have challenging dungeon content to be able to play on my main character? Why is that a bad thing?
1 Like
The Deadmines
Shadowfang Keep
Gnomeregan
Dire Maul
Scholomance (orginal version)
BRD
LBRS
UBRS
MAgisters Terrace
Escape from Durnholde
Blood Furnace
Shattered Halls
The Culling of Stratholme
Halls of Reflection
Pit of Saron
The Forge of Souls
Trial of the Champion
All of Cata dungeons, loved them all!!!
Wasn’t a fan of any of the MoP dungeons.
Loved all the WoD dungeons minus The Everbloom
All of the Legion dungeons minus the Seat of Triumvirate
BFA dungeons were all pretty fun.
Hated every SL dungeon
Hate all the DF dungeons
I think dungeon design just declined a lot in SL and carried over into DF.
5 Likes
Yep, the idea that you only play 1 video game or MMO just causes burn out.
Blizzard wants you only playing WoW, and the game is designed to the max these days to keep players only playing this game. I think it is way healthier for a MMO to have players reach a completion point instead of being hamfisted into these silly content treadmills that really don’t have an end point.
These concepts were ripped straight out of action RPGs that have seasons. The more that WoW has leaned into this, the more the game has deviated away from what made WoW an fun MMORPG.
The current developers basically turned the game into a seasonal ARPG.
4 Likes
I just don’t get how the dungeons you listed are fundamentally different than DF dungeons.
Like how is blood furnace “significantly better design” than neltharus for example?
You listed some mega dungeons like BRD ect and yeah those would be better compared to other mega dungeons
1 Like
Or, we aren’t being hamfisted and just do it because we enjoy it.
You not liking something doesn’t make it bad. I don’t like football, does that make the NFL a failure?
Get over yourself. M+ is probably the main reason WoW is still going strong.
2 Likes
You are getting hung on the mechanics of the fights, I’m talking about the feel of the dungeon, the theme, the setting and the aesthetics.
The new dungeons just don’t feel that immersive anymore.
Neltharus is probably the only dungeon I like in DF.
3 Likes
This definitely isn’t true. The rework with this expac was the first one ever.
The tier 3 crafts say hello.
Do you have a source for this claim, like some verifiable data to show the game was going to die without M+?
5 Likes
Yeah but then you list blood furnace.
That’s gotta be one of the most boring dungeons of all time. It’s just red with orcs and imps.
4 Likes
I love that dungeon, it felt very Warcraft to me. The mechanics are boring and trivial by today’s standards.
2 Likes
Sure, I’ll link it right after you link your verifiable data on how m+ is killing wow.
I also never said wow would die without it, only that the game wouldn’t be going as strong as it is now. No, I can’t verify that outside of basic common sense.
1 Like
It’s still the best MMO entertainment on offer, although FFIVX is an alternative of sorts.
Your hypothesis that M+ is the sole culprit, doesn’t seem to hold up. When Blizz was independent and laser-focused on WoW (Vanilla to Wrath), they were at their peak in terms of creative design and capacity to build that design. What happened after Wrath? Oh wait, Activision bought out Blizzard and became ActivisionBlizzard in 2008. Now you have a business focused on profit and maximizing efficiency. The creative talent all took their golden parachutes and bailed out. I believe the guys running the show now really are doing their best, but they do not have the creative freedom that the original team from 2004-2008 had… they are under schedule/delivery deadlines and are asked to cut costs at every quarter, because it’s all about profit margin for ActiBlizz. The CEO could not care less about the games and the gamers, it’s only about what will earn more money for his stock options and for other shareholders.
That’s much more likely why we get “recycled old dungeons” as part of the current seasonal offering. M+ is very popular (15M participation as recorded in Raider IO Leaderboards and Blizzard’s own poll), so it’s not going away.
Thinking that M+ is the problem suggests you just don’t like it and anything you don’t like is a drain on dev resources that should go away. I don’t like PvP (since WoD), but I’m not naïve enough to suggest that one of the three pillars of end-content should just be deleted. 
1 Like
Bad (probably troll) take, and fortunately, nothing will happen because you don’t like some very popular content. M+ is not the root of whatever issue you actually have with wow.
Have a source for this claim as well?
All the rumors have pointed that DF sold horribly. Sounds like M+ isn’t having the impact that you think it is.
5 Likes