If you want to compete at the highest level you have to do other content, that is just part of playing an mmo. Same way mythic raiders have been doing m+ since it was released.
For most people that stop at 15(maybe 18 in DF) they don’t have to do mythic raiding at all.
As someone that tends to play caster classes with long unforgiving cast times and poor movement capabilities that gets screwed by multiple affixes, oh no poor melee woe is me.
I gave frost DK (2h) a go last season and it was so easy, just not caring about multiple affixes.
The only annoying one was spiteful and that was about it.
Back on topic, the M+ changes are bad and now M+ only players are being forced into raid even more which is unacceptable
Some people have lives ya know.
That’s literally the same thing as now though.
People need to stop thinking raiding is this insane skill challenge when it really isn’t. The challenge of raiding is having social capital and group coordination. Mythic plus at higher keys has just as much personal responsibility and player skill required as the toughest raiding. It comes down to people lording their social capital, amount of e-friends, and free time over the rest of the community with more limited or varied playtime and less friends to get into the right groups. If Ion has such a hard on for raiding and wants to kill mythic plus so badly, which it seems he does, he should make mythic raiding more puggable and approachable by the kinds of players who do mythic plus. This could be done by having the bosses laid out so groups could form for individual bosses more easily (live ff14 savage) and putting less gimmicky mechanics, that the only difficulty is talking on a mic. A lot of people don’t seem to want to do that so why are they forcing it at this point. Ion is old and out of touch let him go play classic and re live his glory days and leave the modern game to the rest of us that aren’t in college anymore. We want a challenge without having to sit in a raid group waiting for hour for Johnny to take a crap, or Pete to grab his food, or bill to have a smoke or some other guy to log in or get to the instance. Raiding just feels like a horrible waste of my limited playtime compared to the action, pace and start up time of mythic plus.
I’d sure hope so, getting to and killing him on mythic is far harder than doing a +18 lol.
Checks Armory Oh hey look, no mythic raid experience. Who could of seen that coming?
Enjoy your 415 gear in most of your slots while M+ players have 418 gear if you want to play it that way, lol.
Thats only because of the initial ilvl, it was tough because you had to farm to be a decent level, after season 1 if your fully geared youre already half way to fully geared.
Lol it’s just heroic with tighter timing and higher damage checks with one more mechanic get off your high horse. Heroic raiding is an absolute joke so I can’t imagine the gap being that wide. I pug so I really have not had the opportunity or motivation to do any because as I said it requires social capital or insane amounts of time to waste.
But hey man good for you. You must really be a god amongst men considering your mythic experience(I only assume you have because I’m not as pathetic as to go looking at your armory). I hereby proclaim to everyone how much better you are than the rest of us who just want to have a fun challenge that doesn’t waste our time. You truly are a king amongst kings friend. There do you feel like a special snowflake enough now cause that’s what this game is about right?
Exactly except now you will need to farm 8+18s instead of 8+15s. So this change is actually a nerf to mythic+ loot.
No, it’s not.
We’ll need to see where the tuning is. In some past seasons, a 10 one season was the equivalent of a 15 the next.
I will eat a shoe if a +18 is as easy as a +15 this season.
Ok explain how it’s not cause it really is. Literally one more mechanic and more
Optimization needed on rotations and timing with mechanics. What am I missing here. Is there some sort of secret phd you need. You people that derive your personal identities and self worth from being mythic raiders crack me up keep going this is good stuff. 
A lot of us just want something more challenging than heroic raiding that’s just as accessible to us. Accessibility is not the same thing as difficulty.
No different than when they bumped it up from 10s to 15s in Legion, and then back to 10s for BfA and then back to 15s at the end of BfA.
The key cap changes. So what.
Why are we still having this debate, the top players in my guild are the one spamming keys, you need those guys to carry the deadweight of those who login twice a week for raid.
Go get CE next season and see. You’re not going to believe anyone but yourself.
If everything was relative, he’s rights. If you had to have 20 people to raid heroic is just tuning with the exception of raids actually being tuned for mythic. Yeah, that extra mechanic might be synergistic with all of the bosses other abilities and change the fight completely but its still just more damage, more hp, one more mechanic.
Can anyone who has played the Beta comment on the stat alotment for the gear?
While yes, the maximum M+ gear we’ll be able to get is lower than Mythic Raid gear by a few iLvls, are we missing out on a big stat increase due to iLvl and stat inflation? Or has Blizz kept that under control?
If we look at upgrading M+ gear this season, a difference of 8 iLvls in terms of stats is what? Maybe 10 or 12 base stats (Strenght/Agility/intel and stamina) and maybe 5 or 6 secondary stats?
Provided the stats are kept more in line with SL upgrading and don’t inflate by huge margins, will being in full Mythic Raid gear really be that noticeable in terms of damage, healing and survivability?
I’ve been arguing at length for all raids to scale with raid size for ages.
The usual “no” people are - funny enough - people who don’t even raid.