There’s a good chance that a Mythic raider has interacted with more Mythic raiders than a random on the forum who’s never set foot in a Mythic raid team.
Oh I see it’s time for them to deflect.
Unless that argument is “I’ve interacted with every single mythic raider and have raided with every single mythic raider,” no argument you make will be able to validate the claim that no mythic raiders care because your experience with mythic raiders is still just a fraction of those who actually mythic raid.
A few specs had BIS from M+, therefore the argument that raid loot was superior to M+ is bunk in your opinion… even though for all strength users as well as most agi they would prefer raid loot in s4. Most healers would continue to use sausage trinket as well, and classes they can line up well with sigil would use it.
Only a very select number of specs would have bis dungeon trinkets and you think that alone defeats the argument. It doesn’t. You acting like raiders are victimized because a few m+ trinkets dare exist is laughable.
They literally introduced Valor upgrades to M+, turning the 3 ilvl nerf into a 7 ilvl buff (so a total gain of 10 ilvls).
Or did you forget that Legion/BfA did not have VP upgrades for M+ gear ?
FF14 raid gear when it comes to handling loot distribution isn’t moronic compared to WoW either.
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It seems if there are this many opinions of both sides of the fence about the differing needs for type/timing of gear acquisition between raid and m+ that the only way to not have both be worse than they need to be is to separate them entirely.
If the argument is that if the best m+ gear came from m+ then too many people would stop raiding, then they should address the root causes of that and not punish the other game mode to cover up the symptom.
Remember when raiders were forced to PvP for loot at the start of season 1 and also raged like it was armageddon? Pepperidge farms remembers.
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I do! And M+ players were also raging about it.
Realistically? It wouldn’t be on its own. S4 M+ loot sucks but it’s fine because S4 is fun.
The problem is DF has bad class design/balance, rehashed dungeons no one wants to play, and a laughably uninspired seasonal affix. Ion has gone off the deep end and completely lost his mind and bad itemization is just one of the nails in the coffin.
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Agree there is a lot the game does better but wow combat and classes and art design are just more fun and that edges it out for me. Otherwise I woulda never come back.
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Do wonder what’ll happen if raid participation tanks even worse in DF lol.
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if Mythic raiding is fun, then why is equal ilevels a big deal?
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You’ve just been in bad Guilds and/or have trouble fitting into a group. Universally calling Guild culture cringe is actually cringe on your part.
The players I know who’ve stuck around for the long haul are all in solid Guilds that have been together since at least TBC. We/They Raid and run keys together all the time and have regular meet ups in the real world including Blizzcon each year it was around.
I feel bad for all the players for whom WOW is more of a solo/pug experience because I feel they’re missing out on what really makes WOW fun and why it’s had such longevity.
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They might have to actually address some core concerns with raiding, and do things like:
- Double or triple the loot drop rate.
- Allow individual boss skips after defeating them on that difficulty
- Have Mythic scale with raid size like the other difficulties
- Cut down on the trash
etc.
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You’re arguing with a bias here. No one’s saying raiders are victimized, that’s an argument you’ve created in your head due to the aforementioned bias you clearly have.
As a matter of fact, the entire premise of my reply was to call out the M+ player that claimed THEY were victimized. My response was that they weren’t a victim due to the reward structure (Because again - they aren’t as I’ve already stated), they’re a victim due to the lack of support 5 man content has gotten and the lack of new dungeons getting introduced.
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M+ isn’t just a solo/pug experience. Regularly playing and coordinating with the same players is plenty social. Big difference is that you aren’t forced to stick it out with people you don’t like.
The guy is arguing with every single person he replies to.
I think it’s fairly obvious what the issue is.
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It’s easy for you to say that l, but for some of us it’s hard to find guilds like that. A lot of them are mega guilds with a close knit clickish core that won’t let anyone else into the inner circle. Good for you for having friends for 15 years I really mean it and it sounds great! but that doesn’t mean the game should only be designed around people lucky enough to have that. Some of us had that once but friends leave the game and don’t come back and people drift apart. We still wanna play WoW and be challenged but we don’t have 19 other good friends to have our back anymore. We are lucky to find 4.
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I don’t need to reply to a post I agree with… I can just like it. Affirming your own opinions with a full post is silly if it adds nothing to the on-going discussion.
Dude those are honestly great ideas. That’s what I meant about making raiding more accessible.
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