I see your point. To get to that level though, it will require grinding monotonous currencies which are forcibly time-gated and activity-gated. Even then, it will only get almost as good as the last tier’s Normal benefits. And if you think PvP is your refuge, it will be even worse. There’s a plan that’s being worked on to revitalize the PvP system, but we have no ETA.
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This is exactly why that idea wouldn’t work.
I’m at current heroic level, not last tiers normal, like what? It didn’t even take more than like 3 hrs a week or so.
Ah, but you see last tier’s Normal is, under this new model, last tier’s Mythic - that’s the gap that’s missed. It’s really quite intuitive and frankly no different than your current experience.
Not sure if you could tell, but this is all tongue-in-cheek. I do find it funny that “Heroic” is just an extra step in the process today and makes no sense. It’s a place for players afraid of Mythic wipes but too elitist for Normal to congregate and discuss the latest meta.
Heroic is place to get SOME, a LITTLE challenge while not having to worry about the roster boss.
If mythic wasn’t fixed to 20 I’m sure a lot more people would do it.
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That’s where I suppose I’m serious:
This should just be Normal. Some but just a little challenge without too much worry about the boss.
This I fully agree.
But normal has it’s place too, imo. I want more people to be able to raid, not less
Then what is the purpose of LFR?
Something here feels redundant.
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classic… challenging, haha ok 
???
LFR is the most popular mode of raiding, last time numbers were out over 70% did LFR (back in mop)
But then you exclude LFR players who cannot commit to raiding for 2-3 hours sitting down and thats not fair.
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That was a long time ago. I guess to get more to the point, I see no reason LFR and Normal aren’t married in difficulty but manageable with a premade. Much like Normal dungeons might be considered. You can do it either way - pug or premade.
@Sinelius makes a good point why not right as I write this haha - Kudos!
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Because many people don’t want to premade, they want the solo experience that LFR provides, and I’m all for that, participation means the bean counters don’t see Raiding as a waste of dev time and money
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Our inconsistent attendance was due to irl issues… some people house hunting, computer crapouts, etc. my entire guild, while we spend hours on the game, is casual. hours spent doing anything does NOT determine whether its “professional level” or not. I don’t do mythic raiding, not because i can’t (well, honestly, i actually can’t. i suck at the game. two months before SL and i finally am pulling decent DPS. but still not at the numbers i should be for my ilvl. but thats nothing to do with the game, thats due to me just being bad. plus i stand in the stupid. frequently.
everything is fine the way it is because it caters to every level of player, and doesn’t exclude anyone.
actually, thats a lie. PvPers get screwed nearly every expansion. but thats not the issue at hand here. PvE contents problem is NOT with the amount of different levels of difficulty. its problem lies in the devs locking player power behind different systems, like AP, azerite traits, and corruption. with the wrong azerite traits, my spec is gimped. i barely went up 4 ilvl points with upgrades, but changed out some gear to get better traits, and my DPS went up 10-20K. more in some cases. sadly, it seems SLs will be similar, with locking player power behind covenant choice.
as someone above me said, stop trying to take away modes of play from others because you don’t use them.
It isn’t “difficult” per say, but pulling more than 1 pack can get out of hand quickly. Whereas retail is designed for you to pull multiple packs together and aoe them down.
I mean outside of PvP most ccs in retail are used for skips or to cheese bolstering.
I do agree retail has way way way more mechanics in classic. Although if you go with the “don’t stand in stuff” mantra - that cuts the list on most bosses by more than half.
Still though - these aren’t fair comparisons…
We are comparing 15 year veterans in retail against 3 month old 60s in classic. There is no comparison to what it was.
Current ‘classic’ is nothing compared to what ‘vanilla’ was. Less addons, less knowledge, less experience, less all of it.
It’s like comparing a professional baseball player in his 30s in the MLB to a pewee baseball player who is 5 (back in vanilla). If that same MLB player goes down to pewee league (classic) today he is going to decimate everything!
Classic really only has “difficulty” in leveling, it’s basically all I do now when i get on there.
They really should have balanced classic, it would have been so much better
I agree with simplifying, though I disagree with the fix you’ve proposed.
Generally I think thr awkwardness comes in at the Heroic level and potentially also the normal level.
Idk. I think overall they’ve tacked on too many “choose your own adventure” things and the game has suffered for it.
If that’s true today I cannot understand how. Not calling for it to be removed or anything, but every time I’ve done LFR (or an LFR-alike, such as the Chromie event) it’s been an unfettered, turbo-frustrating crapshow. It was so bad in Uldir that I haven’t touched LFR since, even though I haven’t done higher difficulties either. I’m just not going to see those raids until I can solo them.
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I honestly don’t have problems in Nya if i’m bored unless i try n’zoth, people can’t press a dang button.
How did the attendance on farm nights compare to your attendance on Mythic raid nights? I’m willing to bet that calendars were mysteriously clear on farm nights.
They kind of do. I’d argue that someone putting more than 40 hours of time a week into this game is doing it professionally. They’re not necessarily playing competently, but they’re certainly treating the game as a full time job.
You can. It just takes time and practice.
Exactly. Time and practice.
Because you haven’t tried. You haven’t bought the right mouse. You haven’t simulated the priorities for your keys in the context of your mix of corruptions and azerite powers. You haven’t bound the right keys to the right mouse buttons. You haven’t installed the right mix of addons. You haven’t done any of the work that a professional player does to optimize their DPS. Finally, you haven’t kicked your casual guild to the curb in favor of a guild full of strangers whose only common interest is a laser focus on Mythic raiding. Is it reasonable for a game to be designed around that level of dedication? Many here think so. You’ll never see most of the players who disagree because they quit long ago.
I’m not trying to take them away because I don’t use them. In fact, now that my youngest is in college, I’m considering (against my better judgement) giving it a serious go again in Shadowlands. I just don’t think that the “every system in the game needs to be designed to funnel players as quickly into Mythic raiding as possible” mentality is healthy for the game’s longevity.