Locking stable flying but not skyriding to pathfinder is stupid

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

There are other ways to slow down falling speed.

I wonder if our parasols still work?

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

No reason it shouldn’t unless they make it SL content only or some dumb thing (provided it is not limited like that anyway)

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

I noticed two of my novelty heathstone did not work in beta

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

which 2, might be some reason or a bug

[Kaledin-uther]

[quote=“Lovelight, post:2571, topic:1896985, username:Lovelight-sargeras”]

You have yet to give a negative to adding this option. Without a negative, if choice is generally good…then this is good. So if you don’t have a negative to this option being added…then it’s a good option to add. It’s all about net positive or net negative. So what is the negative to adding this option?

@Lovelight-sargeras

I have said numerous times that having DF gated behind the campaign, to be treated the same as SF, would be fair.

The rest is a strawman.

This has nothing to do with this debate. It is a totally separate idea. You are also by the way saying allowing SF at the same time doesn’t matter because all flying is bad. So why not if they are not going to remove PF?

Also, how can you think DF being gated the same way is fair…but un-gating SF the same way is not also fair. That is just illogical. I think both would be fair…the current way is actually the least fair option, and I a not arguing the fairness. I am arguing the simple point of WHY NOT?

@Shadybolt-thrall

No. Because the point is that they can. That’s the entire point.

Ah but that is different. If they actually can then it gains them nothing to have SF. Again, where is the negative to add SF in that equation? I have not seen any reason to not add it, just a lot of people saying basically “oh you don’t need this”. Totally different from saying adding SF at the start is bad for the game.

@Shadybolt-thrall

I used the installation of an elevator where otherwise there would only be stairs available. To quickly summarise:

The negative there is cost and a number of other things. What is the negative of adding SF alongside PF? That’s the crux of it. If it helps even one person and there is no negative…why not?

@Shadybolt-thrall

If a person’s disabilities are so severe that one cannot complete the bare minimum of merely playing the game… then no type of flying or the like will be able to aid 'em where they need their ‘elevator’.

Maybe. There are lot of issues out there and you are saying that just because they can we shouldn’t listen to what they are requesting even though it costs nothing to do it…no negatives just you don’t need this deal with it. I don’t care about that argument. The can they can’t they is extremely fraught with issues and doesn’t matter until well after the question of…is there a negative to adding it?

[Nayaga-lightbringer (Nayaga)]

Not at home, so I can’t check that out.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

fair enough, just like to try and get to the bottom of such issues when possible. So I’d apricate it if you can answer which ones when you are able.

[Lovelight-sargeras (Lovelight)]

@Kaledin-uther

This has nothing to do with this debate. It is a totally separate idea.

Incorrect. People perceive the timing disparity as unfair. If Blizzard gated DF the same way as SF, that would be fair.

We would all be grounded equally for our first campaign play through.

I get you want both to be unlocked minute 1. These are two different ways to try to achieve fairness.

Talk about sidetracking things, sheesh.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Evilperiod-aggramar

Did any of you read all the threads about how various people have had disabilities and are having issues with normal flight?

@Evilperiod-aggramar

Did any of you read all the threads about how various people have had disabilities and are leaving over it?

It’s weird you say this… yet didn’t you call me a liar and block me when I told you I have a disability? lol

@Evilperiod-aggramar

There are people with handicaps, and you just said it is not a problem. HOW DARE YOU.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

I can’t tell if you are trolling or not with this.

If you ARE serious, I am handicapped

@Evilperiod-aggramar

I no longer believe anything you post Quivermeth. Have a good life

@Evilperiod-aggramar

I think some of you are really poorly emotionally educated and are just here to spread hate over problems some people are having and ya’ll can bugger off

Then say this.
As well as white knight for people with disabilities.

Then follow it with…

@Evilperiod-aggramar

In short, eat a satchel of Richards, I just dont care about you whining in favor of making things harder, and sometimes painful for others

So much for being “emotionally educated”. I guess you didn’t show up to class that day or you just live and breath being a hypocrite.

Oh and I can’t forget this gem:

@Evilperiod-aggramar

I do know there are people in game with disabilities that are genuine

Remember folks. You are only allowed to have a disability if evil approves and it goes with their agenda.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Remember folks. You are only allowed to have a disability if evil approves and it goes with their agenda

More like you are only allowed to speak up about it if you are not one that has learned, if not mastered, making lemonade out of lemons.

We also have this gem from another:

@Panwokfry-draenor

And quite frankly, no your disability does not need to be taken into account when those affected do not suffer from YOUR particular disability. You’ve made it clear YOUR disability does not stop you, therefore you have removed yourself from the equation. Others with OTHER disabilities ARE being affected.

My disability does not stop me because I DON’T LET IT. Living with disability should mean learning how to work within it, not let it stop you from things you really want to do. It is not that my disability does not affect me, but that I do what I can to LIMIT the extent it does affect me.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

Yup. The hypocrisy is legendary in this thread.
It’s so hard to actually discuss the topic because they feel the need to derail with the victim nonsense or belittle you because either you are ‘lying’ or you aren’t the RIGHT kind of disabled lol.

[Kaledin-uther]

@Lovelight-sargeras

Incorrect. People perceive the timing disparity as unfair. If Blizzard gated DF the same way as SF, that would be fair.

We would all be grounded equally for our first campaign play through.

I get you want both to be unlocked minute 1. These are two different ways to try to achieve fairness.

Talk about sidetracking things, sheesh.

You brought up the fair thing, and this made no sense to me. How is it fair to put them both behind a campaign completion, but not fair to allow them both up front?

Campaign gate both, everyone walks
No campaign gate for both, everyone flies
Campaign gate SF but not DF, some walk some fly, or at best some play the way they want some don’t.

How was this sidetracking anything?

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

Yeah, the way I was taught, and forgive me for getting a bit religious here, is “God will not tie your shoestrings”. In other words, no one will do things for you all the time, so you have to figure out ways to do things for yourself, You might get help more often then not, but that is just that, help, not someone to do things for you.

I also take the stance of “ask for help on things you CAN’T do, not for things you WON’T do”.

[Lovelight-sargeras (Lovelight)]

@Kaledin-uther

You brought up the fair thing, and this made no sense to me. How is it fair to put them both behind a campaign completion, but not fair to allow them both up front?

Campaign gate both, everyone walks
No campaign gate for both, everyone flies
Campaign gate SF but not DF, some walk some fly, or at best some play the way they want some don’t.

How was this sidetracking anything?

Yes, I brought up “the fair thing” in a comment to another person. You decided to reply and try to claim it as an invalid topic of discussion.

And yes, having both flights unlock by the same method, being either gated behind the campaign, or available minute 1, would be fair in both cases.

@Kaledin-uther

How is it fair to put them both behind a campaign completion, but not fair to allow them both up front?

@Lovelight-sargeras

I get you want both to be unlocked minute 1. These are two different ways to try to achieve fairness.

Did I suggest otherwise? Do you want to side track even further, and debate that point as well?

[Deunan-atiesh]

So this is now just “Virtue signaling: the thread?”

Lotta people in here equating all disabilities as the same in terms of overcoming their limitations and telling others to just “pull up on those boot straps! I did it so can you!”
What a brain dead take.

My involuntary muscle spasms are glad you “didn’t let” your disability affect you. Sadly the one size fits all approach falls flat. Pretty privileged stance to take.

My options are either ground mount my way through TWW or keep crashing my dynamic flying mount. With steady I have more control but now likely will not have it when it matters more to me, during my initial leveling. Not that I use dynamic in anyway now since even with the motion sickness options on I still get hit with it ( I hate it, it sucks, it’s the life I live. I buy stock in Dramamine.)

INB4 pity parties, further virtue signaling and talking down to others.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Deunan-atiesh

My involuntary muscle spasms are glad you “didn’t let” your disability affect you. Sadly the one size fits all approach falls flat. Pretty privileged stance to take.

That wasn’t what was being said at all.

Example. You say you are disabled. Then I call you a liar.
The person above you says they are disabled. I don’t even question it and jump on their bandwagon. Then proceed to belittle you.

Also you are jumping in with this nonsense nearly 2.5k posts in

@Deunan-atiesh

What a brain dead take.

Why even bother contributing if you are just going to be toxic? Literally becoming part of the problem here.

[Kaledin-uther]

@Lovelight-sargeras

Yes, I brought up “the fair thing” in a comment to another person. You decided to reply and try to claim it as an invalid topic of discussion.

Uhm you said one would be fair to me, so I went down what is fair. You just said it and I replied directly to it.

@Lovelight-sargeras

I have said numerous times that having DF gated behind the campaign, to be treated the same as SF, would be fair.

The rest is a strawman.

You just only said it would be fair to double gate, not to open it up.

@Lovelight-sargeras

Did I suggest otherwise? Do you want to side track even further, and debate that point as well?

You really don’t see how debating options being fair is directly tied to this idea? I mean it is the actual OP’s point that do both gated or both open. I am fine with that, and have been from the start.

I found the first playthrough of DF much more fun than my first playthrough of Shadowlands. Now there are a lot of reasons for that but at least one for me was the lack of flying. So that makes me side on the both open side, and the world designed with flying in mind.

I think it has the least detractors and the least red flags for people with disabilities. I see very few downsides compared to the split least fair option.

[Deunan-atiesh]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

That wasn’t what was being said at all.

@Antiman-bloodhoof

My disability does not stop me because I DON’T LET IT.

I believe you believe that. Despite it being said in this thread attached to a “boot straps” post. Not everyone has the same options for management of their conditions.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Also you are jumping in with this nonsense nearly 2.5k posts in

I’ve popped in a few times already and see the dismissiveness of the posters here and comment.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Example. You say you are disabled. Then I call you a liar.
The person above you says they are disabled. I don’t even question it and jump on their bandwagon. Then proceed to belittle you.

Reword the example so it’s readable. Currently it is not. The poster I am referring to is using his disability as a shield for why he isn’t belittling others with disabilities while applying an incorrect one size fits all response then acts upset when others do the same.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

Why even bother contributing if you are just going to be toxic? Literally becoming part of the problem here.

I mean, why contribute if you are just going to show up and do nothing but belittle and troll others as you have the whole thread? Why derail a stock complaint thread that might actually be a good space to discuss the issue of disabled players and their interactions with dynamic flight?
Instead you chose to be inflammatory and tell others “its not a big deal” when it directly impacts how others play? The level of erasure in your posts is pretty telling.

Or should I hop onto some appeal to authority fallacies? Seems that’s your bread a butter though, as well as dismissing complaints while saying there are no real complaints about steady flight being locked?

ad ignorantiam fallacy in action.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

It’s only a “hot topic” because you won’t let these threads die

“It’s only a hot topic because people wont shut up about it.”
you perpetuate your own reasons then use them as evidence while shutting others down who have complaints.
I mean, your involvement in this thread is just as an instigator. So hilarious for you to call others out for that.

FWIW I’m not really waiting to be yet another person you tell to just deal with it and be told how to feel on the issue. I am sure a snarky response is to follow, something about “one of those” I bet.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Deunan-atiesh

Not everyone has the same options for management of their conditions.

No one ever said any different. I even stated

@Antiman-bloodhoof

Living with disability should mean learning how to work within it, not let it stop you from things you really want to do.

To sum it up for you: If one has a disability, they can whine and moan about it or do what they can themselves for it and THEN as for help to deal with it.

In the course of this topic it has been case after case afer case of “whaaaa, my disability means I can’t use x” then “then use y, oit will get you the same as x without the issues x has” and that is countered with “if you are telling us to use y, you are treating disabled people like second class citizens”

It is NOT that they are disabled that is the issue, it is the idea they are using it to try and force compliance, and at this point, a lot of them need to watch out for malicious compliance.

[Lovelight-sargeras (Lovelight)]

@Kaledin-uther

Uhm you said one would be fair to me, so I went down what is fair. You just said it and I replied directly to it.

You replied to my comment to another poster. try again

Here is your comment. You can see I was replying to Shadybolt if you click through:

@Kaledin-uther

I mean…isn’t that a fair argument? If one side says they can’t do something while the other side can…and it would be very easy to let everyone do what they want…what is your argument against that? That people are whiners for not getting something Blizzard could easily give them? That doesn’t make sense, it’s just mean.

@Kaledin-uther

You just only said it would be fair to double gate, not to open it up.

Again, incorrect. I’ll link what I actually said a second time

@Lovelight-sargeras

I get you want both to be unlocked minute 1. These are two different ways to try to achieve fairness.

And finally;

@Kaledin-uther

You really don’t see how debating options being fair is directly tied to this idea?

Well, Just a few posts ago you said it was “a totally separate idea”

@Kaledin-uther

This has nothing to do with this debate. It is a totally separate idea.

Lets end this, its really draining.

Edit: In fact, I’ll end it by muting you. Have a good one.