LFR (Looking for Raid) , good or bad

It was certainly illustrative of the flaw in your logic of declaring anyone not wanting what you want to be a “form of control.” (You not seeing the condescension in your own argument really takes the cake in this.)=

No contradiction here. Have you never heard the phrase “Feeling alone surrounded by people?”

Do you need me to break that one down for you, Barney style?

Empirical experience?

You wrote that with a straight face?

so·lo

/ˈsōˌlō/

adjective

  1. done by one person alone; unaccompanied.

You could’ve google that

Do me a favor and take Video of you doing the Jinth’alor quests in Hinterlands…
Then maybe the last Battle for Hillsbrad?
Murlocs in STV?
Star, Hand, and the Heart?
Literally the end to every single quest line in STV?

And those are just the ones off the top of my head from the horde side.

I’d like to see you solo those, at level.

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You opened that door by suggesting my points were “asinine”. I simply retorted with my brand of name-calling.

You wouldn’t offer anything of value even if I did.

Are you saying that I haven’t played the entirety of classic since its inception back in 2019?

Since you’re arguing in a cryptic manner, I don’t know exactly what it is you’re trying to say.

And that’s why I’m calling you a disdainful hypocrite; The mere usage of any queue system, RDF, LFR, skirmishes, etc. means interacting with other players.

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This is probably the last time I’ll respond here, it’s not even the topic anymore but:

Funny, I’m pretty sure you opened with something along the lines of “they just want control.”

Which was asinine. You not liking how I illustrated it is I guess just bonus for me.

Not to anyone else, they already figured it out.

You’re trying to use “Empirical” as support for an opinion.

(Psst: Empirical blank] is used as evidence for objective items, not qualitative opinions.)

Then why is the (well reinforced) trope of RDF/LFR groups “Silence” until something goes sideways and tank or healer are vote kicked.

If you’re in a group and have zero connection to anyone also in that group: You’re alone, surrounded by people.
Solo.

Good day.

Because I believe you, that you weren’t trying to be condescending at all…

Exactly how I meant it, in which I played throughout all of classic with “hands-on” experience, to know that I know what I’m talking about…

Are you saying that doesn’t happen in Era, didn’t happen in TBC, Wrath b4 RDF?

That’s what I mean by “empirical”. In which I experienced first hand…

That you don’t know what you and/or I’m talking about.

I didn’t know I had to be best friends with anyone I run groups with.

And what exactly is on the other side of that “social” coin?

PPL like you ready to welcome me with open arms into your guilds and raids.

You talk this social game but the last type of ppl I would ever want to group for anything, are disdainful ppl like you.

And I’m describing the majority of guilds out there, throughout all of WoW…

Speaking from “empirical” experience.

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Still more than 90% of the quests are meant to be done solo. How many quests are in the Battle for Hillsbrad chain that are done solo before the last elite quest in the chain? 5? And I can cite just as many elite quests in BC that require 2 or more players. The colossal rock beings in Hellfire. Several elite Naga in Zangarmarsh. The elite spider in Terrokkar.

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When did he say that he regrets making WoW, I can only find him saying that he regrets making LFR.

What kind of delusion are you living in? You’re the most conspiratorial person I’ve ever seen on these forums, I’m gonna refer to you in my mind as the WoW conspiracy theorist.

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In my case it wasn’t being bad so much as lazy and, as usual, uninterested in raiding from a lack of experience (and burning out at around 73 because I thought doing Nothing Boring about Borean without any addons was a good idea) instead of a distaste for the attached requirements. :stuck_out_tongue:

(for reference, back in Rift’s Storm Legion expansion I was apparently a pretty decent DPS for the spec I was playing, even though it wasn’t the optimal spec for that class…mostly because the AoE it had was kind of terrible)

This is where I am; turns out not feeling required to do something on a weekly basis means a lot less stress about the game. :smiley: :smiley:

Personally I think it’s poor value for the money (same as if it was the same, but raiding instead of BGs), but that’s because I’m a journey>destination person. There’s also the whole anti-boosting “learn your class” argument that exists, but controlling how anyone else plays is literally the last thing I’d use against that desire.

Whether things like Dungeon Finder worsen the game instead of improve it, however, can be seen by the performance of games with it vs. those without it. FFXIV is the only other MMORPG that can still charge a sub, and to a major degree the game’s built AROUND having that feature from the time you unlock the first dungeon to having every Job at the level cap, with the only thing not being available through Duty Finder is the most recent raid.

See, this is the kind of thing that made me write that “occasionally a good point” sentence in that other thread; you just made one. :smiley:

That may be you, but I’m out doing stuff while the queue’s going. Those reps aren’t going to grind themselves.

Which, to reference the original competitor, that’s why WoW succeeded while Evercrack and FFXI failed to make the same impact; REQUIRING groups after a certain point only works while there are still players around to group with.

While they’re a fun challenge to see if you can do them solo, that’s about all the real value they have at this point.

You really think you’re gonna find a group for The Corrupter at this point in Wrath?

There’s a few Alliance quests that strongly suggest a group, but that’s because there’s a FORTRESS in the middle of Redridge full of Elite Blackrock Orcs.

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I think if GDKP’s were banned it wouldn’t be too bad. But I’ve seen some fully geared pugs that don’t know boss fights in the very slightest. RDF hit hard the first round, but with people buying their armor this round it would be an absolute madhouse. I think it would result in people just being scared to have any pugs at all.

Then why wasn’t LFR allowed to be used for all difficulties, all raids, in its inception…

Like RDF allows?

Why did Rated BG’s come, and will come again, without a queue system?

Why was there talk of keeping gamma out of RDF before ICC launched?

Why do skirmishes come with an automated queue but rated arena does not?

Short answer to all questions…

There’s a policy of segregation the company wishes to employ regarding the casual playerbases and the elitists…

With the elitists dictating that policy.

If you’re freez, then you’re gonna foam at the mouth at me regarding my views on LFR.

I know you’re not it’s biggest fan.

I think if it doesn’t bring its own lockout and difficulty level, then it’s fine. I don’t even like Normal/Heroic raids though… and not 4 different lockouts 10m/25m Normal&heroic. Just 1 is better, imo.

If there is only 1 lockout and people want to use LFR, go ahead, imo.

:woman_shrugging:

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It’s not allowed because LFR by design is how you get casuals, people who don’t raid into raiding. It’s not like RDF because dungeons can’t be compared to raids, raids have the best gear in the game while dungeons only have the best gear while you haven’t done the first raid, as soon as you’ve done your first raid dungeon gear starts to go away.

I don’t know what you mean, queue what? more BG’s?

What? When? I heard the exact opposite.

Maybe it’s the casuals whining that they’re getting stomped by those “elites” and they’re asking to not be queued with them.

I probably shouldn’t have said “almost no” since it’s such a subjective and relative term. To be more specific there’s about the same number of elite quests in BC and vanilla but still at least 90% or more of the quests are designed to be done solo.

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My point is, that everyone seems to miss, is that you should be able to access content through whatever grouping method you want, whether it’s a queue system, pug, guild, etc.

And I’m not saying to redesign content for lesser difficulty…

I’m saying to let the queue systems access whatever anyone wants to do, any difficulty.

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And you can, LFR provides a way for casual non-raiders to actually raid and for them to potentially pursue harder more rewarding difficulties.

You can’t expect a group of randoms to be able to do a hard raid without communication which is why LFR is its own difficulty.

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Yeah, well…

Same thing happens already with Paletress in gamma.

For every group that wipes with Paletress, there are others that succeed…

Your group is either good enough to complete the content or it isn’t…

Random or not.

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Literally just kick and dispell, that’s it.

If the LFR loot tables were different from normal/heroic, would that matter to you as one of those LFR demographics.

In a rather recent interview for his new riot mmo. He said that wow was one of his biggest failures.

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Thats fair too, should have included that

The biggest selling most popular mmo of all time that he will never again repeat in his life is his biggest failure. What ever.

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