The game is big enough for all of us. Just wish that blizz and the M+ community could see that. 
Don’t you wish you were the only geared player in the game?
Question, because you are right that the game is big enough for everyone but…
Why is it in that case that folks likes to randomly and persistently attack folks for enjoying Mythic+ in that case? Or having a differing opinion to anyone who spouts exceedingly negative opinions, regardless of validity of their associated claims?
It looks like it goes the other way around, that folks who enjoy M+ are enjoying the game, Blizzard caters to folks playing the game, and then you get randomly attacked for doing M+'es on these forums or for enjoying the game either as a whole or some aspect of it
So… if the game is big enough for everyone, would you mind not attacking folks who like M+? Like, this entire thread is derived from folks saying “If you don’t want or care for timing a key you don’t have to”, that sounds like someone inviting you in, not attacking someone
Yet, most folks seem to, in varying levels of politeness and good faith, disagree with that sentiment, and instead argues that M+ is toxic or ‘killing the game’ because folks enjoy playing the game; your comment wasn’t been a whole load of personal insults but… you seem to think that there’s not a huge anti-Mythic+/Blizzard sentiment here, regardless of validity of people’s claims
It’s not toxic or killing the game. I’m doing low keys right now on my Druid. Just got drape of shame from kara. Respect goes both ways. I’ve already said many times over the course of these debates that if you wanna do something and it’s fun then do it. But if it isn’t fun then don’t. It isn’t a matter of one side being right and the other wrong. All opinions are subjective. I don’t like watching sports either but I won’t poo on anyone who does. That does not mean, however, that because someone else does that they can poo on me over it. It’s not super fun for me but I do it sometimes. Same as I imagine M+ only people feel about a BiS item only dropping in a raid. My wife enjoys higher end content than I do. That’s life. Lol
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Not everyone likes this “thing I don’t like”. The point is not everyone likes this “thing I don’t like”. It’s killing the game.
People who think keystone dungeons are speed runs (25-40 minutes) never did challenge modes.
I don’t even like solitaire or bejeweled to be timed. Not liking timers isn’t something that is wow or dungeon exclusive.
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That’s cool, I love doing +2s on my lesser played toons. Everyone is pretty chill and it’s so easy no one is rushing.
But you don’t actually know that, and considering your suggestions have all been easier than the existing system, the Mets chasers would absolutely “need” to do it.
Urgh… I still have nightmares about doing Stormstout Brewery Challenge Mode Gold…
A fair point i suppose, i only expect them to not play something if they are that vehemently against it, even in concept here.
I mean you don’t expect for example, a person who are vehemently against single-player action RPG games where you have to improve by dying and learning the mechanics would ever play Elden Ring…
…You know, just because it’s not combat, doesn’t mean it’s automatically easier, right?.. I mean combat is not WoW’s traditional combat we come to expect, and it has it’s own challenges and such.
*want.
And again, that’s not something that’s going to jolt me honestly. It’s a sort of thing that exists in any game really.
Do you M+ people have fun doing M+?
Just seems like a lot of arguing over it.
I think the issue is, if you had a comparable difficulty/reward idea, they wouldn’t be so against it. Same way people who primarily m+ aren’t against mythic raids.
Ok, I’m just going off ideas you’ve offered which haven’t been comparable imo. I think they’d be fun gameplay, but still haven’t seen how they would work on a progressive difficulty setup.
True but you mentioned it as an argument, which is why I addressed it. You’d 100% have a good chunk of players doing your mode in addition to m+ for loot.
Yes, we have fun doing M+. You can clearly see by the number of runs we have. The “players” on the other side of the fence, idk what they are doing with their time.
2 million runs and counting.
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You think you’re having fun, but you aren’t. You only do those runs because Ion and his Elitist Jerks goon squad are threatening to doxx you and tell your moms you’ve been sneaking ice cream if you don’t.
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That’s a good point, except, some people will just disagree with me regardless even if it matches up on what their expecting. 
I really don’t want to try to cater to people whenever i’m making a suggestion, not just because of that possibility, but because i’m making a suggestion i like to see most of the time.
Ovbiously not all M+ people here, just a subset of those who see challenging untimed dungeons as a problem.
That’s fine, but it’s important to note that the game has challenging things that aren’t combat related. And i know somebody will chuckle, but puzzles are one of them. Whether in platforming or something like jigsaws or things like that.
Which is the primary point. 
I’l get back on you when i do think how these ideas can be used in a progressive difficulty setup here. One popped in my brain just now is those puzzles where you need to memorize things, like in some skyrim dungeons where you need to match pictures on the wall to the mechanism to open the door. Only harder, by having more pics, and the consequence for failure much greater.
I’m not sure how completionism is meta really, i think meta falls more of just being the most efficient and taking the best possible choices, then just 100%ing a dungeon, but i digress.
I was really disappointed when GD let me know I wasn’t having fun. The truth hurts I guess. . . 
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If the challenge was equal you’d see a lot less opposition.
Platform games are challenging in wow because the thousand year old engine is trash at them. Jumping puzzles where you have to sit 3 feet off the platform to hover in the air aren’t challenging, they’re bad.
And even if everything worked right, that’s a way lower level of difficulty than combat challenges. Which is fine, but rewards should be lower to match.
It’s not though. Reward/challenge is just as important when this type of content is being discussed.
Unless you’re getting a different puzzle every run, that’s not going to be progressive difficulty. Even if you get different ones, they have to be way harder than basic changes like the maze in mists, which is already way less difficult than the combat is.
If an easier mode gives the same rewards, the meta chasers will run it into the ground to get what they need.
You can have your tickles and grins in easy content. I want IO and meters for competitive content.
are yall really saying “meta completionists” what in the world LOL