I see your bear and raise you a dolphin
This could be a nice little side quest, to keep giving closure to all does nasty lose endsā¦ accountability or not, it would still be healthy for the story moving forwards to new fresh start. Maybe even putting an end to these discussions lol. (IMO)
I guess what a lot of players here at the Story Forums have said is proven trueā¦ there needs to be a consistency to story and lore, specially in game, like the outcome or not it has to be consistent otherwise we get THIS kind of confusion. 
3 Likes
Hardly.
You are speaking of a vision, a dream that Drekāthar had.
Not an actual event.
A vision which eventually came to pass. But the Night Elves shut down trade due to the Wrath Gate Incident.
As is eluded to here.
āā¦The war to the north is over. We must now turn our attention to our own lands, and our own needs. It is an unfortunate consequence of the events of the Wrath Gate that the Alliance has a fresh reason to oppose us. While I realize that to some of you this means nothing, and others are glad of it, I assure you that no one is glad of the fact that the night elves have, for the moment, shut down all trade avenues with us.ā
Itād be nice.
Getting to see Camp Taurajo again, seeing Hawthorneās goal as to spare as many civilians as possible as his intent, to see what heād actually done was doom them to death out in the Barrens, etcā¦ Both sides see what they couldnāt before. This wouldnāt be likely to change Baineās take on Taurajo being a, ālegitimate military target,ā but at the same time even he would probably benefit somehow, getting to see the suffering and pain those Tauren suffered with his own eyes, rather than making comments about, ālegitimate military target,ā when heād never seen what happened.
2 Likes
Still wrong. Night Elves shut down trade because of the brutal attacks on the Druids, which again, is why Carine dueled Garrosh. That is the lore, and any eluding that it was because of the Wrathgate is conjecture.
That quote just says the Wrathgate created tension between the factions, NOT that it was the primary reason for the Night Elves cease on trade.
Iā¦ I literally copy-pasted the text.
Thatā¦ that does NOT say it just created tension tension?! It outright states, that the night elves shut down all trade avenues! And Thrall was still thereā¦ Thrallā¦ was stillā¦ there.
Cairne dueled Garrosh after the druids was killed, TRUE.
But that was while Garrosh was Warchief, and Thrall was on his way to the Maelstrom.
Jaina didnāt have to personally dart around Dalaran spraying civilians with a minigun for him to feel this way. As the purgeās conductor and instigator, its death toll and excesses are ultimately on her.
3 Likes
And the thing you pasted does not say the thing you are claiming. Reading comprehension is hard though, no judgment.
Honestly, better just end this before it gets embarrassing.
It says exactly that.
This is even worse than Zerde, and Zerde isnāt even close to bad, reallyā¦ he and I just have a fundemental difference in understanding of the same text.
You outright deny what I copy-paste.
1 Like
Because it is wrong. Thrall was still Warcheif when the Twilight Hammer framed the attack. He refused to condemn the killings which only fanned the fires of the growing tensions.
I have discussed this aspect of the lore for years, my guy. Donāt come at me.
The only thing Iāll disagree with you on, and itās a bit of a quibble, is that the Wrathgate wasnāt the precipitating incident that cause Tyrande to rip up the peace/trade treaties, it was the massacre of Nelf/Tauren druids (by the Twilights) in Ashenvale.
Wrathgate wasnāt the spark, but itās almost certainly why Tyrande took a hardline stance after one incident.
2 Likes
Thing is, even if I was to relent and say it was the reason (it wasnāt) it is still a really, really silly take, to say āThe Night Elves stood by and let the orcs starveā as if they had some moral obligation to give them food after the Horde straight up used chemical weapons on their allies.
That is like saying the Allies were wrong for blockading the Germans during the World Wars.
āā¦The war to the north is over. We must now turn our attention to our own lands, and our own needs. It is an unfortunate consequence of the events of the Wrath Gate that the Alliance has a fresh reason to oppose us. While I realize that to some of you this means nothing, and others are glad of it, I assure you that no one is glad of the fact that the night elves have, for the moment, shut down all trade avenues with us. ā
It says it right here.
Even the nerds who write at wowpedia caught it
The land of Durotar was naturally harsh, and recent signs of elementaldistress and disasters had further weakened the orcsā land. Now without reliable supply routes, and the night elves of Ashenvale refusing to allow trade with the Horde following the Wrathgate fiasco, the citizens of Orgrimmar were on the brink of experiencing a famine.
Read the textā¦ it says it right there, black and white.
The skinning of the night elves happened later.
The attack on the druids happened with Garrosh as warchief. It could not have happened at the time while Thrall was still warchief.
i mean, if someone is skinning my people allive and i know is dependend from me, i would stop trade aswell until the deeds are punished and the responsible are given to me.
Orcs face an starting famine? Not my issue at this point, ānice talkā is over if something like this happened.
And guys, the night elf donĀ“t trade with the horde either since years, orgrimmar and durotar still exist. And the only āoutpostā in ashenvale belonging to the horde is under siege and no one can enter in or out, its totally cut from any possibility to reach their homeland.
2 Likes
Letās just add this to the list of Horde players reaching. The Purge, Taurajo, and Night Elves āLetting orcs starveā
I get Horde players want to have the moral high ground from time to time. I agree the Alliance should be allowed to be the bad guys sometimes too. The problem is Blizzard has not written the story that way, and PRETENDING that they DID is just a delusion.
2 Likes
Trade stopped before that.
The skinning of night elves happened as a result of that combined with desperation.
Does not excuse it, but THAT IS how it went.
Wrath Gate happened.
Night Elves refused trade.
Some shadowy figures skinned night elves in ashenvale, Thrall refused to hand over who he suspected.
Thrall named Garrosh Warchief and left.
Hamuul made good on his promise and arranged a druid negotiation meeting.
Twillight Hammer agents killed druids and sabotaged any possibly negotiation.
That is the turn of things.
1 Like
Then donāt come crying when your neighbors to the south invade you as to not literally die? Treaties work 2 ways.
Do you comprehend the idea that there were options besides smugly telling an entire race to go die in the gutter when you were literally treaty bound to assist them via arranged trade deals? Especially when the orcs may not have even needed that help if not for Proudmoore defoliating Durotar?
I mean, they were defortesting Forestsong, Warsong Gultch and using Chemical weapons anyway soā¦
Thatās a funny argument, āI stop trade, that means you get to make war on meā.
Is that the morality you are following? Trade is still a voluntary act.
and at this point you could argue that the horde/orcs do not act in good faith either, instead of hand over who he suspect he leads directly to an escalation by denieing so.
Tyrande clearly said that before any talk about new trade relations the suspects must be handed over, this requirement was not met, so thrall was not intereseted in trade, if you ask me.
True.
But trades still stopped because the Horde was blamed for the Wrath Gate incident.
Everything else is irrelevant here. Trades stopped because of the Wrath Gate, I provided clear-cut evidence of that, if only people bother to read.
People didnāt even have to go ahead and find the books themselves, either on pdf of physical book. I straight up provided the text.