^
I feel like I’m reading the same text wall for the 500th time. I don’t even care to respond anymore. It’s just Mauden’s paradox at this point.
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Grats on 243 posts in a 1063 post thread @kel
Like its actually sad
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Most of the people for 2h in this thread. Its the most common denominator in these threads.
You don’t have to read anymore either while spamming the same thing constantly which doesn’t do anything.
It’s sad you counted.
That doesn’t answer the question even a little.
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Sorry that you don’t like it, unless you actually want me to go through this thread again and name drop everyone that falls under this umbrella.
People people talk about how much more damage 2h did, either through just damage numbers or dps. It continues to this day. I miss 2h damage, I miss the 2h obliterate damage, 2h was better. Trumpknight was another person who was saying these things of how much better 2h was.
I kind of do because I literally only remember seeing Dreadmoore doing it and if you’re making an assertion then it’s on you to back up your claims, that’s how debates work. Do you have a single quote for Trumpknight? If you do I’ll add a second name to the list, though that’s still a far cry from “most of the people in this thread.”
EDIT: they also didn’t need to count, the thread tells you at the top who the most frequent posters are and their post count in the thread, at least on mobile.
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You can also just click on the person. Im not a moron.
And lets see, 3 posts from Trumpknight saying how 2h was better, dw always needed to be buffed up to be attractive and so it wouldnt tickle people, 453, 458 and 461. They were asked to provide evidence, and never provided any. I rather not go through the over 1000 posts to find the people who have been saying 2h was better. Its mostly been the same people in the first place talking about how great 2h was.
All of these threads run together. Make a frost thread about the playstyle and it turns into a 2h thread, make a post about the SL cinematic and it becomes a 2h thread, weapons being datamined “2h frost in Shadowlands boys!”. Its an obsession. My only obsession is proper information. If someone has proper information and they provide it I have absolutely no reservations of saying I am wrong which I have done already.
That’s definitely somewhere we have common ground.
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In PvP*, and I abundantly demonstrated why.
Somebody else posted the patch notes for the weapon changes, but you plainly denied the mass of buffs that DW was getting over the years while 2H generally stayed within a 10% range of its original damage. Just like you denied the numbers that were generating before your eyes in the video I made to demonstrate how laughable Frost’s melee is. Every single time somebody shows you hard evidence that proves you wrong, you just deny it. That is why several people stopped talking to you. You haven’t presented a shred of evidence that counters any evidence I presented and substantiated in the threads. If you just want to slap-fight every living thing that likes 2H Frost, whatever, but stop referencing me with no context or citation, and like I’m not even here. That is incredibly dishonest and condescending.
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If I had the “Thank You!” gif and could use it here, I think I would have done just that in response to what you said. Cause you’re god damn right in that post here. And I mean in a good way of course.
Does this really have to be explained to you yet again? Specific ability buffs like Frost strike, is not a weapon set buff. 2h used frost strike too. So if it was increased by 5000%, you cannot draw a link to “it must have been for DW” since it increases by 5000% for 2h as well.
This is some basic stuff that I dont want to explain yet again for you to spam that “this circle” quote you like to spam.
You can go look up these damage changes, you can look up the changes to motfw, which was nerfed once in cata by 2% (which is the 2h specific ability which is what you have to look at being changed otherwise its a spec buff or nerf since both weapon sets used the same abilities). Buffed in cata to 40% more damage to obliterate and 10% increase to melee damage. Then buffed again in 5.2 to 15% melee damage, and then another buff in 5.4 to 20% increased melee damage for 2h.
THAT is exclusively 2h buffs. In WoD ToT was baked into it and the 2h portion was buffed again to 50% obliterate damage (up from 40%) and melee damage by 35% (up from 30%) while wielding a two-handed weapon.
Look at ToT, added in 3.2, rune strike was added to it in 3.2.2, and then no changes until MoP where it increased Frost Strike damage by 50%. This is where the focus started, in mop. But even then there was no buffs to ToT when this change was added in 5.0.4. In fact there was a nerf to ToT somewhere, probably beta, where the increased Frost Strike damage was only 35%, thats a 15% nerf to Frost Strike damage from who knows where, but in 6.0.2 the 50% increase stayed, but then was increased to 100% in 6.2 and those were the changes.
You my friend are just flat out wrong. I shouldnt have had to repeat myself since this was discussed back then. See why I have to repeat myself all the time?
Frost Strike buffs, Obliterate buffs, Howling Blast Buffs, Frost Fever buffs mean absolutely NOTHING since both sets used these abilities. In patch 6.0.2 Frost Strike was increased by 100%. Guess what that means, it happened for 2h too.
This is such simple basic stuff I dont know how you can possibly not understand it. This is what made balancing it so hard, because if you werent tuning MotFW or ToT by themselves, changes to abilities nerfed or buffed both weapon sets.
NOW who is creating this circular conversation? Go to gamepedia, it covers wrath to legion. It shows you the buffs and nerfs to abilities, Obliterate, Frost Strike, Blood Plague, MotFW, ToT, Howling Blast and whatever else you want to look up.
Its not my fault however that you dont understand what you are looking at. Dreadmoore tried to say that FS was continuously buffed and Obliterate was continuously nerfed which is again just false.
Shall we look at that? Lets see, nerf to FS by 5% in wrath and it could be dodged parried or blocked, which those are pretty big nerfs.
4.1 was a buff to 130% weapon damage up from 110%. MoP nerf to 105% from 130%.
5.4 buff to 115%.
6.0 damage has been increased by 100% buf its runic power increased by 5.
6.2 deals 20% more damage
6.2.3 damage increased by 10% 7.0 now deals 500% of weapon damage up from 88%.
How about obliterate? No changes in Wrath.
4.2 150% weapon damage down from 160%.
5.0 damage increased from 150% to 230% and bonus damage was removed.
5.4 Now deals 250% weapon damage up from 230% weapon damage.
6.0 Now deals more damage on both main hand and off hand weapons, but no longer deals additional damage for each disease present on the target. Damage increased by 30%.
6.2 Damage has increased by 20%, but deals only 80% of normal damage against player-controlled targets. 6.2.3 Damage has been increased by 10% and came with some hotfixes like full damage to other players, Frost Strike and Obliterate have been reduced to their pre-6.2 damage levels, obliterate once again deals full damage to players."
7.0 No longer has a chance to cause your next Howling Blast or Icy Touch to consume no runes. Damage increased by 170% (might be 70% since it says 35% for each weapon)
7.1 Damage increased by 20% hotfix “obliterate damage increased by 19%.”
What do these tell you? Spec buffs and nerfs.
Also, with that video, the damage shown was exactly what I said. I said, if its doing that low of damage, then mob armor is high. Did you miss that or something?
Also, people can go look at these posts that I linked. It doesnt say “in pvp” anywhere in those posts. Just a statement that 2h was better.
So you are just flat out 100% wrong. And your little buddy Frostlich has absolutely no clue what he is talking about either. Even when asked he presents nothing. Oh the Shadowlands is another world, and the Nathrezim can teleport to other worlds. Nowhere does it say that the Shadowlands is another world. Its an assumption not to mention Blizzard has already said he is wrong. If he wants to do what you have accused me of failing to do which is a blatant lie, then fine, prove me wrong or make a discord where him and like minded people can go chat about how they want Frostmourne back so bad and if it doesnt happen they are going to cry.
Its pathetic how you guys have to infest every single corner of things that have nothing to do Frost even if its not about 2h but make it about 2h, or derail it with Frostmourne, or say how DW weapons are just hotdogs on sticks and pathetic or getting threads shut down because of attacks on other players because they cant handle something that doesnt follow what they think exactly and freak out. Its pathetic.
I’m not reading all of that, because the purpose of my statement was to tell you to stop using my name if you’re just going to make off-key claims about things I said without even providing citations or context. I should also add that your constant insult-filled rants about 2H supporters is just harassment now. Every time somebody says something about 2H Frost you immediately jump on them and start mouthing off about 2H supporters, insult them, and single out completely unrelated people by name, after they’ve repeatedly asked you to stop.
YOU are in 2H THREAD, infesting OUR thread and insulting US in childish tirades. If you don’t like discussions about advocating for 2H Frost and Frostmourne, then flag the threads and LEAVE. If you’re constantly coming back into the very threads you constantly bad-mouth and berate, along with the people in it, when you could just I don’t know, not click on the threads and hide them, then you’re just picking senseless fights and that is harassment.
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No counting necessary, it shows the most frequent posters and their number of posts at the OP.
The top three are you at 249, then Dreadmoore at 85, then Trumpknight at 84.
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So you wanted evidence, I gave it, and you refuse to read it. Right. Also, I was asked, who else other than Dreadmoore said that 2h was better than DW and I provided him 3 of your posts to go read that says 2h was better than DW. It didnt have pvp anywhere in there either.
These threads are also NOT about 2h or Frostmourne that I brought up, if you would have read my post, like you just admitted to not doing, you would have known this.
Do you know that YOU started this entire harassment bs going on? It was even stated earlier in this thread, in the 200 post range, that you had to go back 4 days to insult me talking about some bs to try to say what I was saying was wrong because “I dont play anymore” because you couldnt handle that you were wrong and had absolutely nothing to put forward just like you do now.
You could do the exact same thing, you could ignore what people post and go on to your warlock like you said you were going to do. But you stick around spamming responses to my posts with someone elses quote. I dont think you know what harassment is either. Its aggressive pressure or intimidation, which I would add onto that, constant aggressive pressure or intimidation.
And maybe if you guys had good arguments and not “2h was better” “DW are just toys” and so on then you wouldnt have people like me coming in and saying just how wrong you are. You want evidence of this, then read my previous post. It actually has in it what you asked for, which was posted before as well, and if you would have read that then I wouldnt have to repeat myself and you wouldnt have to put your spam in here quoting someone else 15 times. That is spam and against forum rules.
And constant insult filled rants? Like your insults? Or other people on your side calling people like me a bastard? Or daft? Or dense? Or any number of other attacks just because they cant answer a single question or they dont like an answer someone else provided? Are you serious?
I already addressed that. Or are you making this discussion circle back on itself again?
Ah my bad, I missed that. One of the faults in skimming the 100 daily replies.
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Wouldnt have to be that many if people would read things in the first place.
I’ve now asked you several times to stop referencing me without citations but you then went and made a grocery list of references to posts I allegedly made, without citations.
That’s gonna be a yikes from me.
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