It's time.. Frost DK and 2 handed weapons

Classes Death Knight
742

Yes Marwyn and Falric were ghosts when we fought them, I really don’t know why though since they were with him in Lordaeron. Maybe he could call on them whenever and wherever if needed from the sword? Maybe the game journal would answer it.

When you use Arthas however from a standpoint for frost he doesn’t use much frost, at all. People just like to inject frost onto anything just to suit their idea. 2h frost dk on a blizzcon slide… wrong that was just generic art from wrath, no spells or anything associated with it could have been blood or unholy without a pet, could be 2h frost, could be anything really. We know what kind of frost stuff Arthas did, and Bolvar. Remorseless Winter is the biggest one. Never used howling blast as far as we know, never used frost strike, icy touch, and Bolvar didn’t use anything but remorseless winter. So from that standpoint you can play like them, 2h and remorseless winter and you are exactly like Bolvar.

I also don’t think the removal of 2h is why frost is so low on representation. Throughout my time playing I haven’t seen many 2h frost unless people just couldn’t get 2 1h weapons to drop which back then, like in Cata, I think frost was the only spec that used 2 1h weapons so they didn’t put many in the game, in wrath they had to use agi weapons and still pulled really good numbers. Legion had a good representation of frost because the artifact gave a lot of stuff that helped the spec, increased resources, increased damage like obliterate crit damage and more. All that was gone in BFA and kept a playstyle that the majority don’t like. Even if the numbers are good, the playstyle is junk and people got away from it. That’s why I did.

Now to bring back 2h would actually be simple, 2 runes combined into one fallen crusader and razorice as a 2h only runeforge, and then allow abilities to be used with 2h, of course it doesn’t address DW having more KM procs, or how DW crit mechanics work but it would bring it closer since it wouldn’t have the 15% deficit that 2h has in terms of frost damage. In wrath they were the same aside from the runeforge, KM procs and DW crit mechanics you did the same stuff just a different weapon and the playstyle was popular during that time. Or just allow a transmog which is the quickest and easiest. Why they aren’t doing it, idk. Maybe they think it would look goofy swinging a 2h sword around as fast as your main hand weapon.

In terms of fixing the spec is a different think but I have some ideas to address issues people have with the spec.

1 Like
743

You aren’t going to get frostmourne as a usable weapon skin. I don’t think ret was supposed to get ashbringer since it technically fell to the bottom of a fel lava pit and somehow magically got out.

744

i don’t think so, you were talking about DKs who DW and “frost dks” and you can only find 2 dks in the entire game who DW before they fore it into legion and start to make then a thing, because they were not common

that would be logical yes, regardless, is know fact that 2H are the main weapons for DKs, whatever the spec

never said he wasn’t, lets quit the strawman, i said he use a shield because its a callback to the war3 unit, he is the only one to have a shield in the game, because its not rly a Death knight thing.

the gameplay reflects the lore, and if the DK main weapon is a 2H it should be used for all specs;

4 Likes
745

What is your point?

They asked for other dk examples that DW in lore. i pointed those out as well as a dk that uses a sword and board. I really don’t care what it’s modeled after, it’s not what was asked. He’s a dk that didn’t use a 2h. 3 of the first dk’s used different weapons. 2h means absolutely nothing other than “I like it, I say it’s this was therefore it is”.

Your arguments are just to contradict and not add anything. Almost like you just want to harass me at this point just because you don’t like me, which I don’t really care. After this post I am just going to ignore you, not because your arguments are remotely good, but because you just derail the conversation like you are trying to do here.

746

Just bring back 2H for frost already, and keep the option to duel wield also…simple. Bring back the DKs of WOTLK

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747

They can’t remove the DW option at this point unless they want to make frost not function in an entire expansion.

DW isn’t going anywhere and it doesn’t matter what the 5 people think that DW belongs in unholy. It’s frost and it’s not going anywhere. The only think people can do is figure out a way to bring it back into the game. Just saying to bring it back doesn’t do anything and it’s probably why it has failed for at the very least 4 years.

748

that because we only have 2, and one then using 2 2H, shows DW is a rare, rare sigh and the class/spec fantasy is indeed more about 2H not DW, thats why people are so eager to have it back

i mean lets analyze yours:

this is a contradictory argument who add nothing:

What it matters if 2 of the 3 first (detail, those 2 are so insignificant that people little care about then and barely remember then, as just random ghost bosses) didn’t use 2h if every other after then use 2H??

Did you cheak the frost abilities icons? could you see how most of then are 2H weapons? thats speak for itself.

you could not care, but tis obviously the reason why he is using a shield even if dks don’t use it, its an exception

yeah great, the victim card, i however didn’t “harass” you, nice try, im commenting about the subject showing how 2H are more iconic to DKs, - regardless of the spec -than DW

you can find one DK who DW, and the other who have 2 2H, the others, like the class fantasy says, use 2H

pretty sure no one said they want to remove the DW option, the guy above you specifically said DW should still be an option

2 Likes
749

He is using a shield because he used a shield before being a dk. How many lore dk’s can you name? Migraine, Thassarian, old 4 horsemen, new 4 horsemen, Koltira, Marwyn, Falric, Tyrannus, Mograines father, Orbaz Bloodbane and some more.

Some used 2h, one used a sword and shield, some DW, some just use 1 1h, some had a staff.

Just because the people you like use a 2h doesn’t mean it’s a mainstay of the class. They use so many different weapons in lore so you are just wrong.

Just look at the new 4 horsemen. Looking at Mograine, I don’t see a 2h weapon on his back from in game screenshots. In one whitemane is using a staff. There is no set weapon, that’s the entire point the other person was making from a lore standpoint to say that weapon restrictions should open up.

You however didn’t understand his argument and still don’t. Seriously what is your problem?

And there are people out there suggesting to move DW to unholy and have frost 2h only.

Oh, and there was a screenshot of Mograine DW in Legion. Things might now have been finalized at that point, but it’s there.

750

Frost-mourne not for frosty? What about SOUL-REAPER. That was just a single rune ability all 3 specs had. Sally Whitemane used a staff in scarlett monestary. Now she has a 2 handed sword strapped to her back. What about path of FROST?

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751

@Kelliste you need to see this.
8.3+ Death Knight Discussion-DW vs 2H PVP Breakdown

The truth comes out at 9:00 watch it before you reply please or we going to be fighting again.

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752

@DK COMMUNITY in the video above mentioned that Ion has asked that players hit him up on twitter for input.

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753

Link so I can check it out? Thanks

754

I believe this is the video he’s referring to.

oh hey I can finally have links.

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755

Thank you Mauden :wink:

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756

You and I had two different experiences playing then, because all I remember seeing back in the day (WotLK and onward) were people choosing to play 2H over DW. Mainly for PvP, which is what I spent the majority of my time doing.

I remember originally when they were first testing the Death Knight Hero class, all 3 specs could us two handed weapons and also duel wield, they could also all 3 tank or dps. I remember a lot of people chose Frost to spec, because howling blast was great for getting aggro as a tank back then. I also remember a lot of people would get upset if you would duel wield as a tank. Everyone wanted a two handed DK tank vs a DW one. I also remember when people would DW as an Unholy DK and the damage was insane, and Blizzard quickly nerffed it… that reminds me and forgive me because this is off topic a bit, but I also remember that ability that would turn an Unholy DK into a ghoul for a time after they died and you could fight for a little bit after you died, or explode your corpse and do a lot of damage… It was an OP ability but man it was fun in PvP! lol

Anyway all this talk about “the good ol days” does make me miss all the things blizzard cut from our class … 2 Handed Frost, Blood DPS, that one ghoul ability I was just talking about, and Death Siphon… oh how I miss that one… it was so much more fun to use than Death Strike…

Hopefully with the Shadowlands ability un-pruning, we will get some of the classics back… Fingers Crossed!

#MakeDeathKnightsGreatAgain

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757

There are screenshots of her using a staff. Like I said however it was probably before it was all finalized, but even the previous 4 horsemen used staves and 1h weapons with 1 using a 2h.

And that pvp video is using a limited window for the sake of an argument. Hes starting with a preset outcome that he created and only used WoD as far as I could tell to support the claims. I can do that as well with Wrath and Cata. Aihpos (Whitenoise) was a DW Frost Dk that pvp’ed and made videos and was destroying people. Go look him up. Even has a video in wrath doing a 28k oblit as DW

758

I dont know why people would want a 2h Frost tank unless they didnt know how to hold aggro. I had absolutely no issues with DW frost tanking in terms of threat or survivability and it was easier to get defense capped and so on because you could use tank weapons.

Maybe people werent using Rune Strike properly or spread their diseases or a lot of other things. I got nothing but compliments from everyone that I ran with because I hardly had to be healed and I kept aggro. In terms of tanking, you made macros for all of your abilities that included rune strike since it wasnt on the GCD with everything else and it did a ton of threat. Getting it active, which DW allowed it to do more due to more tank stats, allowed for a much easier time with tanking.

While the other specs could DW, there wasnt a point. 2h for those specs were just superior. There were times when Unholy had certain things work with DW, but some of those were bugs and never intended like Sudden Doom proccing off of offhand hits as well as main hand. That was never intended and fixed in like a week. People were just abusing it in raids.

Doing what I did back in Wrath, the start of gear score, you pretty much had to be a min maxer or be something that people couldnt decline. They could decline a DW Frost dps, but they couldnt decline a DW frost tank since you could search for a long while for a tank. And then eventually the Icy Touch threat change happened while in Frost Presence due to the avoidance nerf in ICC so there was a lack of Rune Strikes, I never really had a problem with it, but it was there. This change meant that your threat could never be touched. I told the other people in my raid to switch to the threat meter and wait for a laugh, let the off tank to get aggro waited a good little bit and then my threat meter just doubled and kept climbing to that of the off tank. They asked if I taunted, and asked what I was doing. I said no, and just Icy Touch. You could at that point just run around like a spaz and Icy Touch everything and not lose aggro.

I ran with a lot of people, ran with some pretty high guilds that just needed someone to tag along and was actually invited back if someone was missing. Solo tanked tank swap fights like I think it was Toravon in the Vault of Archavon where once you got to so many stacks then you needed to swap, well my pugged off tank couldnt survive for whatever reason and I solo tanked it with proper CS use, AMS at the right point so that the stacks would fall off and so on. I did it as DW as well.

I think it was bad players back then that just couldnt perform. I ran into a 264 hunter that did like 5k dps while I was barely out of 245 and into 251 and doubled his output. Guess who got shafted out of gear, me.

I wouldnt hold my breath with good things coming from the un-pruning. I think they are just going to give enough “class” spells back and the rest are going to be left relatively untouched for the sake of balance. The new dev team does not have a good track record in that department. If they keep all these extra systems in as well as trying to balance DW and 2h, and whatever else people want done to the other specs you can just forget about balance and then people will just look for people using what performs the best. And then people will complain that people arent taking them into raids because they are using something that underperforms and you are back at square one and the reason why things were removed in the first place.

759

In hazzed video at 6:30 ish in the video showed legion PvP. And legion frost is much better than frost dk in bfa. I can see the damage difference. Frost surely needs a rework on mechanics. I would be fine with Dw but the weapon choices I prefer is two handers. But I’m sure they are working on how to get it incorporated and fix. We just gotta wait and see.

2 Likes
760

I sure hope they are indeed doing just that.

761

And i tanked cata dungeons as a 2 handed frost dk. Throne of the 4 winds and lost city of the Tolvir on heroic as frost. Good cd management. And you were out damaging that hunter at what level? Because i know when dks finish lights hope and have full blues they used to be stronger than any other class in the game for several levels until you plowed thru all the old burning crusade content. Icy touch built threat like crazy when you spammed it and it came out super fast partly due to Frozen talons passive. Back when dks provided utility… The good old days.