dont need to worry about the social contract if your anti-social. work smarter not harder.
Hate speech is nebulous??
I’m sure this is the same that is said in toxic relationships when one partner says physical abuse term is nebulous.
Some people like to pretend it is as a way of rejecting any kind of enforcement of it. They like to imagine that their free speech rights are being violated because “anything could be construed as hate speech” and “if I say something you don’t like, that can be hate speech” when, in fact, hate speech is clearly defined and limited.
Some people try to muddy these waters intentionally to protect their abhorrent behaviors, and others do it unintentionally because they’ve bought into the fear promoted by the bad actors and often share a political alignment with them.
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The way you are framing these legitimate concerns is dismissive and dishonest. Kijo presented a strong case about the political environment that would bring about a lot of concerns and anxiety around this topic and WoW’s Community Council is to dismiss their concerns and insult them as impolite?
Where I moved from, the environment became incredibly hostile and toxic where I had supervisors lecturing the crew sometimes for an hour insulting my ideological and religious beliefs without him realizing my beliefs, I had to tolerate it to not face repercussions. Family members on both sides would burn family bridges over stupid issues like who they voted for or listening to the opposite party. One uncle with a doctorate is still having marriage problems and is being mocked as an evil idiot over voicing concerns about China. Coworkers acted like I was something my past behavior and current mixed marriage indicates I am not so they can feel superior and despite all that I hoped to build bridges and not have to hide my faith and deeply held beliefs so in this new environment I shared that I was of the opposite ideological position when my coworker politically proselytized. This led to non-stop conversations about how I should curb my beliefs, trying to convince me to change my beliefs, until it came to a head where I asked, we agree to disagree. Now I am in a harassment situation because now where we had no problems working together, my coworker looks for problems in my work and uses every opportunity to interrupt my work and lecture me ever since the political and religious talks ended.
This is not just about politeness or not being a jerk. The environment is a landmine field and Blizzard potentially just added a ton more mines into the field that will be more damaging than some random person getting upset and leaving the group. I play just to mind my own business, appreciate the art, and collect the goodies. It should not be another place where I have to worry about un-intentionally upsetting someone due to their ideological priors that I am unaware of and then they have the ability to abuse institutional power against a perceived slight.
I maintain that the people who are upset about that contract are people the game doesn’t need. If you’re worried about being banned for something because of this, then you’re the problem.
It’s literally just “be a decent human being”.
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Actually, in the past Blizzard has stated that there are limits to this behavior, and such game disruption could be actionable. We have no way of knowing if anyone has ever reached those limits, or even specifically what they might be.
Oh they have. It is really really rare though. It has to cross into what Blizz calls Zone Disruption where it impacts a large number of players for days or weeks at a time.
I think camping the same lowbie for weeks on end would probably qualify.
I think for many, it’s the political and social context of what this seems to many to be a part of.
As I’ve said before, and started a whole thread about it, I am happy to sign the new social contract, even if it’s just a reminder of the TOS we all agreed to anyway.
Further, I believe in the spirit of the new contract, which is to treat everyone with respect and good sportsmanship. And if we can muster it, kindness and helpfulness.
But there is a social-political context here that any reasonable person cannot ignore.
On top of this, there’s Blizz’s own behavior, which by it’s very nature of doing business in China, undercuts the social message they are foisting on others.
Not to mention, Blizz’s internal problems.
Mirasol doesn’t represent the CC, as a whole, first off. Secondly, Mirasol is clarifying and trying to put out the fires. But because people like you don’t like what Mirasol saying, you attack Mirasol and get all offended about it.
I’ve been practically saying the same thing Mirasol has, and I’m no CC.
You’re a little late for that because the Squelch (which was BEFORE this contract) has been an abusive system ever since its implementation. And, that’s all automated. Nothing has really changed with this Contract. Except, we get a warning, now that we might POTENTIALLY reach the Squelch or other forms of disciplinary actions. So, you can put a stop to whatever you’re doing that’s causing you to be reported instead of being Squelched immediately.
Very well. I admit, I’m not a lawyer. I have little patience for these “nesting doll” legal document antics. So, Hate Speech and descriminatory language? I concede the point. However I’ve still demonstrated “Rules Creep” with regards to Spamming and Advertisement.
NO. If someone specifically says something to offend ONLY ME, then I MUST have the exclusive agency to forgive. Your anger notwithstanding. I’ll grant that it comes from a well-intentioned place, but it cannot overshadow the finality of my choice. This is the difference between Justice and Mob Rule. The problem with An Eye For An Eye is that Everyone Goes Blind. And it seems to me that this is the problem we have right now: Too many blind people.
But it is. You as much as say so yourself when you admit that it “may require some interpretation”.
Koji made the case the concerns are about the political environment that people are anxious about due to real life experiences. Mirasol reframed the issue to politeness assuming people who have concerns have issues with how they conduct themselves. How does that not fall under being dismissive?
This proves my point. You do not know anything about me coming with a prejudice that I have been reported in the past. The only time I have ever had account issues was when my account got hacked and took all my items and gold, something Blizzard remedied.
As far as moderating the social system I have no answers and do not pretend to know. Never had problems. Never harassed or have been harassed since I created my account during TBC. I have only had issues in real life when people talk religion and politics, something I do not want to bleed over into something that is meant as an escape.
I didn’t specifically say AFK. The cow debuff is normal. You should socket some comprehension gems.
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I live in Texas… It’s an open carry state with no regulation.
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And look what happened in Uvalde.
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But racist comments may not offend only you. That is the point. Just because someone is offended doesn’t mean they are offended on your behalf. I agree that no one should be reporting because they think someone, somewhere may be offended. But no one should feel that they don’t have a right to report something that upsets them personally, even if it’s not directed at them personally.
I don’t have to tolerate racist, sexist, homophobic, etc. behaviors in the public places I go for recreation. It doesn’t matter that I’m a cis white male. You don’t have any agency over whether or not those things upset me, just like I don’t have any agency over whether or not they upset you. I’ll never tell you that you should be taking action, or filing a report, or trying to tell you that you should be hurt, upset, or offended. That is your business. But by the same token, I have the right to decide for myself what I will accept under the same conditions. Not for you, for me.
This may seem like hair splitting, but it isn’t. Hate speech is clearly defined. But anytime there are boundaries there will be gray areas that may be on one side of the line or the other and it requires interpretation to determine where it falls. But hate speech as a concept is clear and not subject to interpretation.
You’ve claimed it, but I wouldn’t say demonstrated. I didn’t look any further than the hate speech and discriminatory language, but there may be clear language about spamming or advertisement. It may also fall under some of the more general climate language. I’m not motivated to keep poring over it, but I will if you insist.
It’s irrelevant.
It’s not being dismissive because “politeness” includes people’s comfort levels of political discussions, in the first place. Some (not all) don’t want it discussed, period. It’s not just about politics, either.
No, you (specifically) misunderstood.
When I said all this:
The “you” form I was referring to, was the “general” use of the word “you”. I never assumed you (specifically) have been actioned. I was merely describing what the general “you” would go through, under the said circumstance, in this case the Squelch and the new Warning system.
You (specifically) made the assumption that I was talking about you (specifically), when I wasn’t.
I’ve (personally) been Squelched and Suspended, before (which I shouldn’t bring up 'cause that’s against the rules but w/e), so IK how the system works. Somebody like you (specifically and others, in the same boat) who don’t know what it’s like, wouldn’t have a clue how the system actually works, compared to somebody else who does.
Now, I’m assuming Mirasol hasn’t been actioned but has experience with the game and equally understands the system, as much as I do. So, we’re explaining how it works, to those of you (general “you”) who don’t.
Exactly.
Yes, see. Consequences for your actions lol.
Stupid metaphor. Blizzard isn’t approaching you in a public space. You are entering their property.
A more apt metaphor is if you entered a restaurant and the host says you need to sign this basic contract that requests you be respectful to the other guests while you dine. In which case, weird… but ok
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Probably not, but if the person says “I’m trying.” and you “Try harder” then you are being a passive aggressive and will very likely get flagged. Look if you can’t act like a decent human being find a guild that will let you be toxic…you can then say al the mean things in the world.
No one is trying to take away your fun…unless your fun is being a bully then yeah you got bigger issues.
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