I’m only really going Venthyr for the tombstone lol.
Can you imagine thinking that picking the best covenant makes you a sheep but mindlessly picking anything but the best makes you big brain
Sort of like talent rows for a lot of specs.
Falsely reporting posts that you don’t like but don’t violate the COC should be a bannable offense. Nothing I read in the OP was aggressive, and in fact the OP is factually correct.
Regardless, this conversation has been somewhat beaten to death and Blizzard has support from enough of us that they’re sticking to their guns. At this point, whining for change is no longer a viable path for you to take. You have two options - accept Covenants as they are at release and see what happens, or take a break from WoW and come back after a patch or two.
Not really. Blizzard made the game, they know their playerbase, they know what’s going to happen. And they’ve been given AMPLE warning of what’s going to happen. So no… I refuse your premise. This fault is squarely at blizzards feet.
Either make content that doesn’t require min/maxing, or allow us to freely min/max in content that requires min/maxing.
Don’t make content that requires min/maxing, then handicap our ability to min/max.
Calling it now… the final boss of the first raid tier all but requires a certain number of players to have a specific covenant ability. My guess… 6 venthyr teleports. Or they’ll troll us and have the boss apply an ultra-nasty bleed that can’t be healed through… requiring the majority of the raid to have kyrian health pots.
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It quite literally doesnt require min maxing unless you are method or limit and going for literal world first.
THE GAME DOES NOT REQUIRE MIN MAXING AT ALL TO BE BEAT, AND THAT INCLUDES MYTHIC.
Report is the new dislike button
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Really? How many locks did G’huun require exactly again? How about KJ? How about Uu’nat? How about spine?
They’ve made MANY fights which required lots of class stacking, or ability stacking, or insert here stacking. It’s not out of the realm of possibility that they’ll make a boss that requires covenant stacking.
Or better put, a covenant ability will make the fight significantly easier.
When a raid group is faced with the choice of a last boss being twice as hard, necessitating double the pulls to kill and simply choosing the covenant that makes the fight waaaay easier… Which do you think they’re going to choose.
And don’t act like that’s our fault. Pull a boss 500+ times, then come back here and tell me that you wouldn’t take the option that makes the boss easier.
You do realize if you go rn to warcraft logs you will find that all classes and specs have downed mythic nzoth.
It is like you are so completely delusional you think world first is the basis for mythic raiding.
Focus on playing the game rather than looking what method are doing and maybe you ll realize this.
The dungeon journal for the final boss is available on WoWhead. The fight is basically just Blackhand but with some gimmicks in phase 1 that you have to do to survive the transition to phase 2. The “cheesiest” thing as far as I can tell is that Death Knights don’t have to do anything to survive the transition since Death’s Advance makes them immune to the shackles.
It’s not impossible that certain Covenant abilities are good… but that’s kind of the point, if Covenants were never exciting, the system would be dumb. Whenever your class has “the cheese”, that feels good.
It’s fitting that I’m sitting on the John browsing this thread
And this is how I know that you don’t know what you’re talking about. I’ll let you figure out what you need to stack on M N’zoth.
Except that’s my point. You’re giving everyone the option to choose “the cheese” covenant as needed for each tier. The talent that makes a fight vastly easier. And you’re giving it to the entire raid group.
If a fight requires 200 pulls to kill with the entire group cheesing the hard part, but 400 pulls to kill with no one taking that covenant. Explain why a raid wouldn’t ensure their entire group took the cheese covenant?
Either way, I’m already calling it.
9.2 - Covenants are easier to swap
9.3 - Covenants are talents, with a “we’ve learned from our mistakes post”
This TV drama is just getting too predictable at this point.
I really do think the “release something that’s not so good then patch it” is an intentional business model at this point
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I mean… I try to keep a positive attitude, but this will be the THIRD time that feedback has been ignored on a feature, only for them to realize that we were actually right from the onset.
I have a hard time believing that they’d be THAT manipulative, but then again… anything is possible.
My eyes went as wide as dinner plates when I realized what they were doing with legiondaries… then they… did it again with corruption.
I mean your post is a bit hostile but you are right. the people parroting meta know what they’re getting into, and know that there’s a chance it may get nerfed. They choose to do it anyways so they can’t really complain if it stays as too good and gets nerfed later.
It reminds me of the people in Warhammer 40k who constantly try to exploit anything that is vaguely worded in the rules, knowing full well it will probably get fixed later, but that doesn’t stop them from trying to milk it for all its worth in the meantime.
Here’s the thing - it’s like Pathfinder. They have to say “we learned from our mistakes”, even if the truth is that they were happy with what happened. Like Pathfinder, they do not want flying in the game, but they pretend that they care about pro-flyers and throw pro-flyers a bone after-the-fact to placate them.
If we spend a year with locked Covenants and strong “advanced class” flavor in our Pseudo-Class Order Halls, that’s good enough for me. You can throw a bone to the haters later in the expansion, and they’ll say “too little too late”, but they’ll lap it up all the same. You say Blizzard is predictable, but you are the one who is predictable. You will continue to pay a sub with the hope you get thrown a bone, and then you’ll get your bone and you’ll be contented to chew on that bone until the next expansion, where you hold out hope Blizzard “learned their lesson” when they’re really pandering to a different group with their design choices.
But it’s only not-so-good in your opinion. Blizzard gets to have it both ways - they release it one way, then patch it later. WoW’s community isn’t a monolith. When I play PvE, I don’t want to be earning “raid bux” to buy raid loot. I want to raid and get loot and have that loot be exciting. Making gear exciting initially, and then later adding in vendor mechanics panders to people who like raid bux but also people who don’t like raid bux don’t have to deal with them during progression.
No, they’ve stated outright that they have liked pathfinder. And each time Ion does, the forums erupts for a few days.
I mean, as I usually say in these sorts of threads, I still have fun in this game. I’ll still have fun and want to play even with the current covenant system. It’s still a net positive for myself. That won’t be the case for everyone. For how many? No idea.
All I can say is that I’m really not looking forward to having to figure out which content I’m going to prioritize and which content I’m just going to have to accept that I suck for.
The best way to envisage this currently, is to imagine that covenants are like azerite essences. Imagine being forced to choose between focusing iris and condensed life force. One is clearly better for M+ (at least on fortified weeks), and the other is clearly better for raids (at least ST encounters, which are typically the dps checks). That’s not the sort of choice I want presented to my character. I’ve already made a similar choice at the class selection screen, AND at the spec selection screen. Don’t make me make yet another choice rendering my spec only strong in one content type vs the other.
And that’s not even talking about how they work with multiple specs. Don’t make me choose one covenant that’s awesome for my spec of choice, but then is truly god awful for the other specs.
What’s that gear have to do with covenants though?
The choice you made at class selection was less informed. If anything, swappable classes makes a hell of a lot more sense than swappable Covenants because you get to experiment with all Covenants before you make a choice. However, WoW’s core flavor is that certain characters make certain commitments to their identity. You can’t change your class, and you can’t change your Covenant (without jumping through hoops).
Warlocks suck at M+ but open a can of whoop in Arena. That’s just part of the game. Some characters are better at some things than others.
Ion has said he dislikes spec-swapping. That’s a pro for the system, not a con.
Only when I first started playing the game. The high level player in me would love swappable classes, but… I think that’d be colossally bad for the game. So no, I don’t want that.
And that’s my point. Don’t add ANOTHER level of choosing which content I’m going to suck at.
Source? He was the one that said they’d let us freely swap between all specs, IIRC.
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