Instead of championing the activity you like in M+ why not have something other people like. On a side note M+ and it’s philosophy ruined this game. Doing them is simply dreadful. Then with no further innovation the M+ system will only have less and less participation.
There’s DPS check, which is the timer, X damage in Y time.
And there survival check, which is like raiding.
If you want M+ gear without a timer it would have to be balanced so that if you can’t time it, you wouldn’t be able to finish it.
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Isn’t that called a raid?
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Yup. How many people are running tazaveesh hard mode weekly? The reality is that they don’t want challenging 5-man fights, they either want free gear or they’re simply toxic players who want to take something fun away from others.
There is no reality where Blizzard just takes out M+ though, so thankfully these kind of posts are just a waste and mostly for picking fun at the corresponding OP.
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Cata didn’t work for pugs that used the dungeon finder. We can make hard modes player constructed like m+.
I have a better idea, how about you just stop running mythics altogether and “we” meaning the rest of us can keep running them as they are.
Player makes request:
Same old elitist hardcore mythic players tell him no that’s not what “we” want dismissing the poster in his entirety.
This is why WoW is in such a state of rot. Individuals who think this is a zero sum game. WoW has enough budget to do both, but the problem is there’s enablers from the community who actively encourage bad design, and promote/want to reward bad behaviors.
Again OP–I think you should Unsub like so many did. WoW ain’t listening to you.
Honestly, I would love it. I love M+, but I would also love “Five Man Raids”. I actually had a blast running Tazaveesh HM. I ran it three times the first week. I would probably continue to have played it more if A) the mail boss wasn’t so bugged and stained my perception of the dungeon and B) if the loot were a bit better (233 is simply not that good when you can farm 15s week 1 of the expansion for 236 that can be upgraded).
This meme that M+ers hate fun is actually a joke. I would bet $$$ I have more fun with the game than the haters who whine about M+. The haters are toxic and instead of trying to find a way to have fun, they simply want to suck the fun out for other people. The idea of removing M+ is nothing but the salty tears of noobs, period.
M+ and Mega-Dungeons can co-exist. Players who like mega-dungeons simply need to vote with their metrics and play the mega-dungeon enough to signal to Blizzard people have an appetite for more. I know I play moderately high M+ keys even though I don’t get loot and that signals to Blizzard I enjoy M+ - Mega-Dungeon fans need to play the mega-dungeon more often if they want to signal to Blizzard they want more. Blizzard watches metrics above all other than monthly revenue.
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No, we don’t. I do not want to be in a dungeon for 2 hours fighting little packs of 4 and spending 2 minutes before each one waiting for someones CC to be off cooldown.
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I’d be fine with it if I didn’t also have to worry about that AND having a time limit
Can you link those metrics?
SL season 1 had more unique characters do mythic+ per raider.io (I assume that is where you are getting your info) than any BFA season. And BFA Season 3 was about the same length as SL season 1 and had half the characters. BFA Season 4, the long patch, was less than SL season 1. BFA season 1 and 2 were way lower, but the tiers weren’t a comparable length.
So I’m curious where your “metrics” come from.
This is a bad idea for a lot of reasons.
At the risk of a forum vacation, his proverbial butt. It’s a personal opinion masquerading as a fact.
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Very few people would complain if Blizz added a new untimed mode today as long as the difficulty to reward ratio was similar to current m+.
When did they put Mythic’s in Classic? lol
Source for your metrics?
Also to OP’s point, they do have mega-dungeons, which present the most difficult non-timed content.
One spin would be to simply set enrage timers on dungeon bosses much like raids have. This would lessen the requirement for an overall timer, though tuning would probably be quite difficult.
I really see the appeal you’re trying to get at and, on some level, I also want dungeons to be these arduous, dangerous encounters that take some endurance. But I also think that the convenience of M+ dungeons not taking any more than like 30-40 minutes gives the game a variety that just wouldn’t exist without it. I don’t want the totality of my PvE group play in the game to be stuff that takes me 1.5-2 hours.
You can also just have really punishing mechanics, but then you risk people whining that the content “feels like a mini-game”. The mail boss, when it actually works and you aren’t using the burn strat, is actually fun to prog, it feels “raid-like”. Killed it the first time actually doing mechancis and while it really soured the experience that it was buggy, when we got the kill it felt like killing a raid boss.
I honestly think the reality is that most people whining about M+ don’t really want content like that though. I can’t imagine a world where the people who are whining about timers are really ready for a 12 minute five-phase dungeon boss.
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I got the metrics from Bellular news that M+ participation is lower in 9.1 then the last season of BFA which is a big yikes. It’s not hard to believe since SL has the biggest player loss of any expansion. Also 9.1 just didn’t bring the players back as it’s kinda a void lack luster patch that is just 9.0 with extra steps. They didn’t resolve any of the major system issues.
Well considering alot whine on here nonstop about keys keys worse thing ever plugs suck but refuse to fix the problem and there’s an obsession I wanna solo everything but pug keys and whine sure it will work out. If you hate pugging I dont get the whole thing of people hating guilds so much to do anything. Using the dungeon finder is no different than using io to make groups. 2021 wow and not using guilds or friends is quite dumb if you dont like pugs and have no patience. Cata was actually way better cause guilds were actually a thing then unlike today guilds basically used for mythic raiding that’s it and no voice in 2021 is laughable the true failure of pugs.