Lmao more mental gymnastics. Want proof? Do I need to go find someone who bought BiS off the AH? Ask the guys who were competing for world first why they needed over 100M gold. And that’s something anyone can get with a card.
1 Like
ROFL how is it strawman please explain
A strawman is an argument you built yourself in order to defeat it.
Yeah but they didn’t spend any irl money did they? Was all loaned gold from farm services and they get the gold back from carry runs either way you look at it both take a latge amount of skill and time investment
1 Like
Not true at all, there’s only certain pieces you can buy. They don’t sell all gear slot BoEs
You aren’t going to win any arguments by being mad
You think I made that up??? 
Shows your lack of mmo experience outside WoW
Win what argument?? Please tell me
You people have never played a pay to win game before and it shows
Which just shows that you’re the unreasonable one.
I wouldn’t call WoW a P2W game because the game does not model itself for spending money to succeed. People just found a way to dump money into the game and Blizzard didn’t stop them, actual P2W games are modeled around the idea that their revenue comes from people paying to win.
And what was the difference between now and before the Token?
World Firsts always use gold farms to fill in gaps in their gear. And other players gladly oversell said gear because they know World First players will buy them.
People are just trying to abuse the notion of pay to win because they’re favorite World First didn’t get it.
Everyone on this forum subs to a p2w game, guaranteed
Someone doesn’t understand pay to win.
Someone else doesn’t understand how pay to win works.
Someone else doesn’t understand pay to win.
The defense arguments of “it’s not pay to win, because I’m gonna make up a stupid definition of pay to win to suit my narrative” is kind of hilarious.
If you can spend cash to gain a power advantage in game either exclusively or faster, then the game is pay to win. As with nearly everything else in the world, there are degrees of this.
There are almost no multiplayer games with micro-transactions that have a complete “win”. As in, you’ve beaten the game, you’ve won, game over. Because that would be STUPID. To anyone who thinks you can’t win in Wow, I’m sorry you’ve lost literally everything you’ve ever done, but there is plenty of winning to be had. This winning ranges from winning a single arena match or bg, to getting rank 1 in pvp rating (which affects your invitation to the actual AWC), to world first races for raids, to completing a raid in general, to pushing the highest keys, etc, etc, etc.
Pay to win does not require the company to directly sell you the win. It’s not like you drop $10 dollars and your arena wins go up by 1. This is stupid. The implications of this are ridiculous. The game does not have to directly sell you a piece of gear for it to be pay to win. The definition, meaning, accepted meaning, functional use of these words, broadly, across thousands of games for years and years is no so specific and limited. If you can buy power advantage, it is pay to win. Period. End of story. Arguing with that either makes you dumb or a liar.
The question, at the point that it is possible to do so, is to identify to what scope it is and if you care about it.
In the past, you could use sketchy 3rd party sites to buy gold, use that gold to buy some gear (very limited spots, usually) or carries. Technically is pay to win, but the company is not allowing it or encouraging it. I say because of both the means and the limited BiS gear slots that could exist, it wasn’t a problem.
Let’s move onto the token. Now you can, via Blizzard, buy gold for money, which enables you to buy gear for money. It becomes questionable, but again, most tiers have only a few BoE spots and aren’t necessarily BiS. It is, absolutely and unequivocally pay to win, but most people don’t care.
Move on to 8.3. Many slots are available as BoE, some of these are BiS stats alone. Add corruption which (contrary to what some clam said in a post) is drastically more than 6% of your damage. Now you can buy 50% power boosts for cash. Now world first race guilds spend $40,000 in gold to attempt to buy advantages. Now, people grinding arena rating to get into the AWC are buying gushing wounds to even have a chance to “win”. Suddenly the community is more concerned.
But, it’s been pay to win, to some degree. Was it to much for you personally? Is it too much now? It is ALWAYS by degrees. No game lets you buy a full set of the absolute best gear, go into a match, get a screen that says “you won the game” and closes. So stop pretending that’s how pay to win works.
1 Like
What pay to win game do you know of that requires a sub?, %99.9 r free to play Games. Which is why they end up pay to win in the first place
You remember all that CoD loot box controversy, along with the patent they filed for a system that would match people with out p2w items with/against people with p2w items in order to get they player w/o to buy them instead of being crushed by them. You may not have played HOTS, but I did, and it was very clear that they would release characters overtuned, and then bring them right in line with a patch a month later. It was clearly to drive sales, and I wouldn’t put any type of shady scheme past blizz
I thought it was multiboxers that made wow a pay to win game.
These claims come up so much it’s hard to take any of them seriously. Especially when what’s his face up there is in the thread starter.
World of Warcraft
WoW isn’t pay to win. Regardless of what you think corruptions are being removed next expansion, so I don’t see the issue here.