Considering that WoW token costs $20…umm that would be a yes.
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It’s the same mindset that plagues BDO white knights. That game doesn’t sell the best gear in the game in the shop, but they sell things that give you more chances and better chances at obtaining that gear.
When the patch dropped that introduced some of those things, suddenly server-wide notifications of people obtaining BiS gear were abundant whereas before it was a Reddit-post-worthy thing to see.
But of course, some people still said it’s not P2W.
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Again, no one buying enough keys to not raise red flags is PUGing keys and showing up in your groups. They either buy like 1-2 keys which raises red flags when they have 2 15s completed and fail all their 7s, or they buy like a dozen carries. The person buying a dozen carries isn’t going to suddenly want to actually do the keys and play the game. If that were the case they would have stopped a long time ago.
Also I am still waiting for your source of bans happening for gold runs. I understand you gotta dig pretty hard to find it, but you WERE talking like you had it on hand.
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I can spend $60 right now on WoW tokens, sell them for 513,000 gold (minimum), buy carries.
Do you know how long it would take to farm 513,000 gold in game?
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Medaax What red flags? there are none blizzard allowed this it’s legal to do. If someone wants to spend hundreds of dollars getting run through M+ keys blizzard can’t stop them anymore because they’ve given the okay. That’s pay to win. It’s expensive pay to win but you could drop thousands of dollars on wow and get run through whatever you want as many times as you could afford.
You could also look at the group finder and join a group. Are you also stronger having bought that carry vs. the people carrying you?
But you’re not buying the carry with $20 you’re buying it with gold. The people doing the carry don’t care where the gold comes from, whether it be from a WoW token or from playing the Auction House. How can it be P2W if people get the exact same rewards by playing normally?
Besides, unlike conventional P2W systems, the WoW token doesn’t “create” gold. You don’t pay $20 and magically gain gold that didn’t exist before. Someone bought your token and gave you the gold for it.
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I am referring to red flags you the group leader picks up when you invite someone. I know it’s hard for you to understand that.
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I think he means red flags as in, if you look you know they paid for carries. Raider io makes it pretty easy to spot carried people.
Looks like you don’t know how the WoW token system works
This is where people are ignorant. They think it’s such an expensive thing that it’s impractical to actually do and so, it’s only a theoretical problem.
They’re wrong lol. I have known people who have dropped literally thousands in one sitting on games. I’ve known people who have made thousands by selling runs at the end of WoD.
There’s a lot, a lot of money that gets passed around in this game. Just because people have begun to use WoW as a legal middle-man doesn’t mean it’s any less.
Why don’t you educate me then.
Kinda sad Blizzard white knights are more annoying than BDO white knights
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Maybe not than the people carrying you but certainly you are stronger than players who could not afford to pay for the same opportunity with cash. This is a divisive decision on blizzards part because it’s basically telling rich players they have direct advantage over poor players and i’m not talking about rich with gold.
@Reshyk because paying 20 dollars and getting all that gold is pay to win. It would take a lot longer to farm the amount of money to be able to afford consistent runs like that than just dropping 20 bucks on a wow token once or twice a week.
@Medaax You can’t say for certain no one exists buying that many keys. Maybe not a lot of players are doing it, probably because most can’t afford but just as sure you are there aren’t players doing it i’m sure there are those who do.
and they still ran through the instance did they not? if they afked they’d be dead or would receive no loot (dead from afking in a boss arena/heavily mobbed area or no loot from afking at the door). again one of two things must happen to “win” in an mmorpg raid/dungeon A) the person runs it themselves and get the loot (which is effort and thus they’ve earned it) or B) they ran it as part of the group exerting at least minimal effort to do damage and not die (and thus AGAIN they’ve earned it). either way you either acknowledge that they actually earned it or you have to take the “win” out of pay to win and thus this argument becomes null and void pointless. you lose the debate either way… either or is the path of least resistance.
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Those people can do the content the ol’ fashion way. Just like the people who you are paying to carry you did in the first place.
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Which is exactly what makes this pay to win, thank you for finally admitting to my point.
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Or they can be carried by their guild. My guild is currently carrying one of our members who just swapped mains to a Shaman, doing all mail except for the tank groups for him too. He didn’t pay a cent.
Again, if I can get exactly the same good/service through only in-game means then nothing is locked off to me. It’s not pay to win.
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Are you honestly arguing that running through the dungeon is the same as earning the gear by fighting the bosses. Go ahead and try to run Mythic EP to M azshara with a group of 400 ilvl players you’ll find you are unable to complete the raid. Why do you think that might be?
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do i need to remind you what the ENGLISH term for win means? “win: to achieve victory in a fight, contest, game, etc. : to get (something, such as a prize) by achieving victory in a fight, contest, game, etc. : to get (something) by effort.” they do not pay to “win” they pay to play the dungeon/raid, they win the raid/dungeon by fighting or supporting those who fight.