I’m by no means a god tier player but I have purple logs in heroic raids and I usually get around 2.5k IO for M+ so I’m at least not brain dead. It may be related to the burst dps burning mobs before we get our 6-7 global casts off to ramp and start dpsing but I can say on average in AoE pulls without Call right now I’m barely above the tank and definitely behind any other class that is a competent player using the generally recommended Dark Ranger M+ build. Im not dooming the spec because I want to see how it plays in keys when trash pulls aren’t 50% hp within first 2secs of pull.
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You keep telling people not to play BM in Mythic or raids…or uh…anything that requires with AOE.
So…
Its bad then, I agree with you.
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Not what I said at all.
Like did you even try to read what I said?
Telling people to switch to MM or surv instead is telling people they are better specs.
Why play BM if those specs are better for most content
Who cares if BM excels at single target for bosses, its not FFXIV where its little AOE and mostly bosses. In WoW its mostly AOE and occasionally a boss. At least for mythic it is, and from what I’ve seen of raiding its pretty much the same.
Even questing the vast majority is AOE, huge groups of mobs everywhere. So its not even for leveling or world content either.
(to add)
Look at warlock. Affliction is good both AOE and single target, builds for both. Destruction isn’t very hip right now, but it has builds for both. Demonology probably is the odd one out though, but it still does decent AOE if built properly. And I only bring up warlock cause its kinda the caster equivalent of hunter, 3 dps specs in one and the one people compare the most.
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Affliction is beautiful. They need to fix beast, it is terrible.
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You do realize that pure dps specs have niches right?
Bm is ST MM is burst cleave and SV is AoE.
Because as a pure you play the spec that’s better suited for the content.
I do. Boss damage matters. Trash damage in raids is irrelevant.
Most bosses are ST with minimum adds.
I have. It’s one of the classes I main and play at a mythic level.
Affliction is a mostly council designed spec. It’s probably overtuned in ST unless they finally figured out how to give it good ST without breaking AoE.
Either way the design is irrelevant to BM.
Destro niche is two target cleave.
Honest question. Do you even read what I write?
I have stated that bm aoe needs tuned up. I’m just not agreeing with the mediocre players that are getting out damaged by tanks because BM is broken.
BM definitely needs a tune up but it’s not as bad as everyone is making it out to be, I’m sitting around 700 - 800k ST dps most bosses however AOE is pretty sad…
BM is also still the king solo spec which is why I’m sticking it out, will more then likely be able clear max lvl delves with ease in S1.
Gotta take the good with the bad
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Snozay,
First, lets toss any raid argument because in a raid you can freely change talents when out of combat. We can freely swap specs to suit the raid situation.
M+ you are locked into a talent set for the whole run.
Right now (pre M+) is a terrible time to look at spec DPS, stuff just dies too fast which not only impacts ramp up specs, but also cooldown usage.
What I believe pisses DPS off is they want to compete and yet are denied competitive AoE DPS due to a spec choice. Put another way, bosses in M+ are 25% of total damage for dungeon and trash is 75% (rough numbers). So a spec doing 20% less in AoE and 20% more in ST… Let use 100, so 75*.8=60, 251.2=30, 60+30=90. Meanwhile The AoE favored spec, 751.2=90 and 25*.8=20, 90+20=110. So (90/110)*100=81.82% of the damage the AoE favored spec did.
Whether above example is true or not, it’s what they perceive. Most people can’t believe they are the problem with the spec, not the spec. The truly competitive, they just move between classes/spec as the seasons dictate.
Waiting to see M+ action before declaring anything on any spec.
Lets not because a spec strength is based on the fights. Raiding is one of the main balance points of the game so no we arent tossing it.
And this is relevant how? People have set builds for mplus and raid.
I know this, which is one of the reasons people whould be running PL for lower keys and not DR.
Ill go off of performance. Not some random made up numbers.
They just released an entire rework.
lol you fast.
Maybe a better question is why can’t we swap specs/talents during a M+ run, just like raid? In a raid a BM hunter can go full AoE for trash or swap over to MM, or vice versa. Then on boss swap to a ST spec/talent setup. It’s a large advantage over M+. My take is people complaining about AoE are talking M+ environment because they can easily change spec/talents everywhere else.
My rough example was to show how I believe people perceive M+ damage. This would probably disappear if folks could swap specs/talents in M+ (well except for the folks who for only play one spec of one class.
Further Blizzard seems to really be leaning into alt support this time around, so people should be able to swap class much easier this expansion. Aka if they believe a Ret paladin is best at AoE, swap on over to that class from say a hunter.
Yeah I really like the removal of the AC -35% aura, they never could sort out how to limit that to just the two hunter pets.
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Nope that’s also a pretty bad question.
Trash in a raid doesn’t matter. It’s literally filler. The damage doesn’t matter.
Mplus is a time trial
Raiding is a big boss fight.
They are apples to oranges.
Your example was terrible.
There is only one troll arguing that bm doesn’t need aoe. It needs it and it is coming. WHY IS IT NOT OUT NOW is the question. Season starts soon.
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I did a bunch of Heroics last night on my BM and switched to Marksmanship, because the AOE feels really bad, it definitely needs a buff. BM is not bad for ST fights, but I can’t see BM being invited to a lot of Mythic + if the AOE doesn’t get fixed. MM I found was a lot better, but I miss having a pet in that spec.
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Thats not even whatr I am saying, I said it neededs tuning but if youre doing tank level damage its a you issue.
Even the rework wont change anything for you bercause your lack of damage is a you issue
Fire mages and beast hunters will be sitting them out. I really hope they have a fix in the coming week.
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It’s about 25-30% better than BM AoE depending on number of targets. You can sim yourself on Raid Bots as the different specs and see the difference yourself.
So what do you know? You are seeing it in practice too.
I had to switch from BM to Survival mid-dungeon because I was at least 25-30% behind in AOE packs.
I don’t even know how to play Survival and I am far, far ahead of BM output.
It’s just fundamentally broken on the numbers, makes me sick.
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I disagree. I have been timing my Delves and My Brewmaster and Prot Pally finish the delves about 60-75% faster than my BM hunter. Something is majorly wrong when a DPS class not only falls that far behind on tank specs and needing a healer companion to do it.
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Yea and that something is player skill issue.
I’ve had 0 issues doing delves on my hunter with bran as dps, and in times that aren’t incredibly fast, but fast enough to the point that a tank won’t be doing them 75% faster.
Granted there is also high likelyhood that in addition to just not playing hunter well, you’re not mathing well, so there’s that.
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Your hunter has below the same ilvl I did when I started leveling
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