"Invite to fun layer"

If you expect 90% of players who start to continue, sure. That’s not going to happen, because the vast majority of players on launch day will actually be Retail subs who’ll come along, play for a bit then go back to Retail.

Whoever logs in into that layer during launch is in that layer until the layers are removed, the only way transfer between layers is to be in a group that is on a different layer than you, which doesn’t work when in PvP combat but does work if you are in PvE combat. I also think people in the same guild will be prioritized to a certain layer, meaning the chances of guild members not being in your layer is unlikely.

As for abuse of layering. I assume abusing layering will be hard, I’m not sure how they will handle it and I’m glad its not my job to figure that out. Using mining as an example I assume if you mined a node in a zone those same nodes and went onto a different layer it wouldn’t appear on your character.

Layering doesn’t work after Phase 1, There must always be one Kazzak, one Azuregos. Ion already promised it wouldn’t be there past the first phase.

They prevent people from rolling on that server and direct people to other less populated servers. Server transfers will be offered. You are worrying about nothing.

You would know about this all if you were really invested into Classic WoW.

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Yeah…with the exception of layering.

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On the Stress test I was in the layer that had the GM. I invited people to a group so they could be in that layer and I was pulled into their layer.

I then asked to be invited to a group in the layer with the GM and when I got in that group I was back in that layer.

This kind of concerns me because if I am out questing and come across a rare or a boss I need help with, and I invite people to my group, it seems like there is a chance I’d end up in a different layer where that rare/boss has been killed.

I’m not a fan.

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Kiwi…that sounds like a bug. Everyone should be going to the group leader’s layer. You should report that with the bug tool in game.


I don’t agree with this comment at all, sorry Eloraell.

I highly doubt that the mass majority of people who had been advocating for these servers for years were retail players. It was players who left long ago and Blizzard finally decided to do this when they saw there was a true demand. That demand did not come from the retail player base. Most of the retail player base laughed, posted the Wall of No and belittled anyone who dared to utter the word “Vanilla.”


I would but I don’t have access any more. Hopefully if it is a bug someone else experienced and saw it as a potential bug.

Now, hold up for a moment before pulling that move…

That can’t work. Layers are dynamic, not static. If they were static, you’d be right. You’d then stay on that layer until it’s removed manually. It would essentially be a server within the server. Which would defeat it’s purpose altogether.

But since they are dynamic, they automatically adjust the currently active population numbers to fit the layers population needs.
Meaning, as long as the population on one server is higher than 2.5 - 3k players (1 layers population, a healthy vanilla realm size), additional layers are going to be up and running, and will constantly attempt to keep healthy population levels within themselves, which means they will shuffle around players as demand goes up or down.

If anything it can be attempted to try to sticky you to one layer, but you can’t stay in the same one forever, and will end up in another one throughout your journey even if you don’t initiate it yourself.


then the servers will continue to crash every time there’s a big raid release or event just like they did in vanilla and the stress test

With current tech they shouldn’t. But it’s all in the cloud now and who knows how they set up their virtual realms.

I can tell you that an unnamed pserver capped at 14K last weekend and there was no lag/crashes. But that’s not cloud technology.

You’re not wrong in that statement. You’re wrong in the percentage of players in the first week who were “advocating for these servers for years”. By probably more of a factor of 10.

I totally agree there will be maybe 500,000 players who continue on after the first month or so. But there will be at least 2-4 million players in those first few, and the vast majority of them will be both retail players who weren’t advocating for Classic, but get free access because of their sub, or players who are returning to the game to see whether its still interesting to them.

And now they’re all eating humble pie as their vaunted streamers post “I was wrong” videos. It’s free for them so they WILL be there trying to log in with everyone else.

And then they’ll decide they still don’t like it and go back to Retail causing a massive crash of the playerbase back to the 500k-ish that actually do want Vanilla again.

I agree that there’s a large market of people who will keep playing. You just keep forgetting about the even larger market of short term tourists.

There’s a really good article from 2009 on how WoW is a bad cloud candidate as such, because it isn’t really divisible, due to everyone needing to see each other. Blizzard completely ignored the conclusions when they rolled out Sharding and its held true to the issues that they face.

You can only divide the playerbase so far before they become individual players, and the less you divide the harder a given core/thread/work unit has to work.

Take THAT Apex Legends!!! :stuck_out_tongue:

The microscopic part is the scope of how much of the game layering will be covering.

Compare the game breaking aspects of instead of layering using different servers ending with dead servers and forcing mergers.

Far smaller of a issue in deed.

Yes, there will be a large number of tourists in the beginning for sure. Many will quickly go back to retail of course. But ya know, I have saw a lot of people in chat the last two stress tests who were from retail falling in love with Classic. I thought that was really cool actually. There were many who had never played in Vanilla and found themselves really having a good time, when they thought they wouldn’t.

It is starting to seem that many of these future tourists are actually starting to really enjoy a game they used to bash relentlessly. Now, will that be the majority? More than likely not. But I have a feeling many more are going to stay than expected.

I’m just very disappointed that layering is going to be used to accommodate those supposed people that aren’t going to stay. What about those of us who will be there for years to come more than likely? So we sacrifice community and immersion for people who could care less about the game? It truly rubs me the wrong way.

After the stress test last week, I was hopeful regarding layering and was starting to be more optimistic about it. But after an experience tonight, it ruined my fun so much that I didn’t even bother to log back in to try to see the end events. I truly just didn’t care. Before that, I was having a blast today and was so disappointed that it was going to be ending soon. It just really disheartened me to see chat literally flooded with “invite” because people badly wanted to see Omar and Esfand and just take part in an event that was happening right where they were standing on their server, but they couldn’t see them.

I can’t describe the feeling I had really, but my excitement for Classic just completely sank. Sure, I finally got in the layer, but seeing chat flooded with the mass amount that didn’t, just felt wrong to me on so many levels.


500,000 is an estimate of people who will play combining both diehard Vanilla fans, ex-players who return, and retail converts. At its height WoW had 12 million people. And while I doubt there will be anywhere near the same crowd this time around, half a million players is more than almost every other MMO out there, and nothing to scoff at.

If a few weeks of layering destroys the next 5 years of gameplay, you need to take a hard look at the kind of community you’re expecting to play Classic. We’re not that fragile. We’ll cope, we’ll deal, we’ll overcome, and a few weeks in, we’ll all be together.

Ok, lets roll back to Blizzard’s intial plan. Sharding. That’ll work way better…

Blizzard stated their dilemma. They stayed the tools they intended to use to address the dilemma. The players voiced their concerns with those tools.

Blizzard, once again, listened to the concerns and adopted a stronger set of tools to address their dilemma.

Blizzard’s track record with Classic is on point.

I say no layering. If the spergs only want to follow streamers around let them enjoy the lag fest it will cause for attention.

Sharding isn’t being authentic either.

So they are not “on point”. It’s an almost authentic wow.

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100% made clear from the beginning we are not getting vanilla or the vanilla launch experience.

We are getting vanilla + modern infrastructure.

“Authentic” was never on the table for these type of issues.