Wait, what?
Picking the “wrong” covenant isn’t fighting “toxic culture”.
Wait, pugging is toxic culture?
I’m so confused.
Pugs generally have higher requirements in general, as there is little to no communication, and everything needs to be set up pretty well for things to be successful.
I’d be interested to see what methods he would propose for reducing this behaviour though
No, I imply I want them to fix this so you don’t need multiple toons, you want us to have to spend the time grinding on multiple toons.
yeah you definitely missed something, I want them to fix it and remove the necessity for multiple characters
Yeah probably, because that is the content you play in, that is the content for the majority, and as I said before it’s going to happen when people want to try mimic the higher tier players, because again they want to copy what is strongest, infact based on just this paragraph I’m inclined to believe you haven’t even encountered these terrible high key or high mythic raiders, because they Do care if you’re good, instead of your class/spec.
,
Yes we all understand people want to be strong. But clearly playerskill comes into account at some point.
Ralph and many others are arguing that you don’t need to be META to succeed in this game. Which is true, if it wasn’t then you wouldn’t see the 19 sub rogues who are 12/12m on logs.
So while yes a majority of people can’t succeed with sub or maybe don’t want to play sub because it’s inferior to the others. Those 19 players have proven that it is possible to succeed in an area where folks are saying it is impossible.
That’s his argument.
This is similar to league of legends which folks don’t play meta picks. They’ll pick champions who have a play rate of less than 1% and still reach extremely high MMR.
I think they should let you swap coveninents if they can’t balance the system like they wanted, but not as freely as talents now. Heck for redoing your AP for your artifact you atleast had to go back to your order hall and pay something.
That’d be the system I’d like. Go to the new covenient, and pay some of that anima or whatever that new resource is.
Was going to say “If you are not a mythic raider it does not matter” but this person actually is a mythic raider…
Dono what to say, I never went for the “meta” or “FOTM” stuff. I am good at what I do and I know my class inside and out for the most part. Casual players will just almost always have more fun then elitists, I try to be some where in between.
We haven’t even remotely come close to saying you couldn’t achieve anything with any class, we’re saying this choice hurts you much more than even the one you made for choosing your class because it has the opportunity to swing your performance versus other players even more than the worst patches of balance we had
Sadly as it stands the system just looks annoying
I like playing different whacky builds but I don’t want to be limited into one build
For example I’d like to play a build to hit the hardest evis crits I can do
However I’d like to play a really really bleed heavy bone spike build at some point
I’d also like to play around with lots of vanishes from the nightfae rogue ability
As it stands I’m going to get punished super hard for trying new things
I mean, there is skill in learning to utilize 4 spells where they shine, over learning one spell, and then utilizing that one spell poorly in situations it wasnt designed for.
Meta trickles down, sometime badly sometime for good reasons. In wow, meta is basicly science at this point because of how much theorycrafting and simulations we can do nowadays with logs analyze.
Nobody should be wrong for eating soup with a spoon because some pro-soup eater ate soup with a spoon. Sadly for Ralph you are wrong for eating a soup with a spoon.
I don’t expect they will be within 1-2%, Blizzard is historically awful at balancing things like this.
I also don’t care all that much. I’m going Necrolord on my main for primarily lore & transmog purposes (I want the Bone wings), and i’m not looking back.
I suppose as long as Blizzard allows people to swap their covenants relatively easy, it also won’t matter in the long run. If everyone swaps to one thing because it’s the go-to for performance, it’ll get nerfed.
It really won’t if you’re just doing CE either, but it will if you’re trying for decent rank
True, you don’t need to be “Meta” to succeed, but the problem lies with the balancing of the Covenants, where some Covenant Choices are 40+% difference over the others. So if you choose these covenants it leads to a case of your actually trolling in performance for visuals, cause of how statistically weaker this option is.
Can we just appreciate infinite stars still does 30-40% of a Demon Hunters damage when he gets lucky after multiple iterations of nerfs.
Yeah look as far as it stands with wow builds often the most fun build just happens to be the meta one because everything works well
Survival hunters for instance can take a build that makes their 20% damage cooldown last for as long as you can keep it up but you need to use lucid dreams to achieve that
Yes that’s why I think it should reasonable to swap them. Like if I ran a club and then you joined, but a day later you quit joined a new club and then the next day you came back. I’d be pretty pissed lol. I imagine the NPCs would too.
So there should be some cost in swapping. Not free like the talents now. But the cost should be from something you farm passively in the game, like that anima stuff.
I’m not in alpha so I don’t know how the progression in the covenients work. But if they’re upgraded with the anima resource, then perhaps you can use that to swap them. You’re already passively gaining the stuff just by playing right?
So folks who play a bunch may not notice a dent in their anima if they swap every raid boss. But folks who don’t play a bunch may swap and not get an upgrade or something.
Then you get something like fire though, fire is too broken and keeps getting more broken, but you won’t catch me playing it, I hate it. Frost is my jam
I ve pugged as a spriest with destro lock recently because when I make a pug I dont look at classes unless I need them due to a specific affix. You can have whatever comp you want even in pugs most of the time, they simply need to not be bad players.
What I am referring to toxic culture is the people who discriminate and refuse to invite X class because community perception is that they are “bad” aka non meta.
You can do a 15 easily as any non meta class even in a pug, a bad DH will be worse but people invite them because community sees them as meta.
That culture is toxic and shouldnt exist.
So in order to eradicate it you need to obviously no pander to their demands aka “let me be optimal during all content by switching covenants like talents”
Then you need to boost streamers that push for a more positive culture that is about player rather than the class
Then you rly dont need people and streamers to say stuff like “you are trolling if you dont pick venthyr” because it only adds to toxic culture.
And of course, you obviously as an individual need to call out and attack toxic culture when you see it because those toxic wannabe elitists like to believe everyone agrees with them because people are silent.
Anyone who cares about min maxing aka playing the game wrong needs to put more effort in it.
In an rpg you build a character for a JOURNEY aka choosing one covenant, you can build your character FOR A SPECIFIC BOSS, but you better be prepared to spend more effort there because it goes against the intended design, and covenant design is quite clearly going towards that direction
There is no necessity for multiple character, those are only seen as necessary by world first raiders or extreme tryhards(who are nowhere near world first) so their opinion is irrelevant because you dont balance a game around the extreme things these people do
Which they shouldnt because they would perform far better if they stuck to a classs they enjoyed and learned it
If you didnt notice earlier the tryhard OP quite clearly stated that they would bench any mage that DARED TO GO ARCANE.
SO the wannabe elite tryhards, care very much about class and spec
Most of the Cov System isn’t even able to be tested right now. All thats really been able to be tested is the Spells tmk.
I’d be fine with Cost to swap - Say if it had a talent “row” but when you want to swap it, it would cost Anima, Gold, or w/e to swap it.
Adding a cost is basicly is just making it less fair and worse only for the portion of players that care.
For me there’s only 3 solutions so far that makes sense.
-Make us being able to switch freely abilities/soulbind external to the covenant we choose that is somewhat locked.
-Make covenants earnable either with a rep grind or a challenge (like mage tower that would get more easy with each patch)
-Make covenant be switchable for each day you play, making them more like what they are small companies looking for a working hand. You’re not gonna deny the guy harvesting in your farm because he also harvested yesterday in the other. You still profit from him even if it’s one day on 2.
I like these two. I just don’t like the freely swapping because then it just feels like an extra talent.
I like the rep grind one or a challenge the best.