Yes but there is still some degree of communication / consistency requirement across multiple players, be that excplicit or implicit. The problem is solo content doesn’t have any of that.
it’s a lot easier to get 5 players to do the same thing than 25
And why not? M+ dungeons rival raiding gear, why not a solo path too?
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Of course but the same thing applies when comparing M+ and Mythic Raiding. Mythic Raiding requires more organization and has more moving parts during the encounter than M+.
For M+ you can log on any time of the day or night and find a run and be done in an hour. Now compare that to doing the Raid.
It’s interesting how these threads echo what has been said about M+ in comparison to Mythic Raiding since it’s inception in Legion.
Yeah I’d agree with this, but that’s also why M+ offers a single myth track item a week and tends to have much smaller margins for error on the mechanics it has compared to early mythic bosses.
Later mythic bosses grossly under reward for their difficulty, but that’s more because the reward cap on the game as a whole is already lower than what one would might logically attribute to them. But for the health of the game as a whole I think that’s fine.
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True but the same design works for Delves. You have less room for error when Solo and you get just one Hero Track piece a week. Adding more Tiers and increasing the drops for Delves using that design doesn’t seem like a bridge too far IMO.
I guess I don’t see the issue just like I didn’t see the issue with M+ getting access to the same power levels as Mythic Raiding in TWW.
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I think there should be. But I think that the purpose of delves was…
- quick pre-season gearing for raiders and keypushers;
- something for those players to do during their downtime later in the expansion, especially for those who aren’t raid loggers; (something a little odd about calling a high M+ achiever who does nothing else a “keylogger”)
- transition content intended to push casuals and solo players into competitive group content.
I mean, if bliz want to make a tunnel of zekvir level mobs where everything 1 shots and have it award myth track I wouldn’t stop them, but I think they’re aware of the limits of what they can make fun and rewarding at the same time.
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They don’t even need to do that. They just need to keep adding Tiers beyond 11 that keep scaling.
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Only way delves can be myth track once a week and no filling up multiple slots would be to make a delve like a mage tower event.
With how delves are designed this would be the lazy way out.
Is that really the case though? Unless you’re going to make cast times scale with difficulty level too?
As it stands if you added T12 T13 whatever all it’d do is hit you harder and be more of a slog.
If that’s their logic, then they need to know it will fail.
There is a large contingent of people who simply refuse to do group content, especially if it can’t be accessed via group finder.
Those people don’t transition to group content, they either do more soloable things or stop playing entirely.
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And? The only ways to make stuff harder is through damage/health scaling and/or timers.
I don’t get what cast times have to do with anything btw.
+9/+10 are easily harder than Broodtwister/Princess/Silken Court on heroic difficulty and the gears from +9/+10 are worse. The first 3 bosses on mythic difficult are easier than +9/+10. That’s when people realised that is the biggest problem.
The source of Gilded Crests is awful and +8 should give Gilded Crests then do something about Challenger’s Peril affix.
No one will be happy with this. If you keep scaling up you will inevitably run into what I call the “shoot horizon”, where you just die to one hit from a generic ranged attack like web bolt. When this happens players will inevitably form 5 man groups to execute full interrupt chains to farm delves for crests (and at this abysmal rate I cqnt imagine people being happy).
At this point you will have created m+ but traded the timer for lives and provided less reward, while also eliminating the solo aspect of the content that was intended to be the main feature of the content.
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While I expect delves are here to stay, I do not expect they’ll ever be a true complete endgame pillar with the current Blizzard leadership at the helm.
The current leadership sees this game as a glorified MMO + esport hybrid whose “elites” must be coddled and catered too.
Objectively, it hurts no mythic tryhard raider if Johnny McCasual gets mythic track items from his vault and uses that gear to curb stomp the meanies guarding Johnny’s flowers. Gear is not a zero sum item where a piece existing removes it from the pool and existing for someone “more deserving”.
What it DOES mean though is Johnny McCasual is far less incentivized to want to play with Timmy LeTryhard in content he doesn’t enjoy and subjagate himself to Timmy LeTryhard’s jerk comments about his worth as a person because he isn’t as good at Timmy LeTryhard (or likely has) the cheap auras doing all the mental work for Timmy and distilling information down to a visual or audio queue for monkey brain Timmy to respond to (thus making him “elite”).
Timmy doesn’t like that because he doesn’t get to inspect Johnny and feel warm and tingly happy pants feelings at seeing Johnny in objectively poor gear compared to his own. If Johnny feels like reading up and studying up on how to more effectively play his class/spec, he’s at least got good gear to go enter raid content that may even be beneath him to get something like AOTC and not need to pay Timmy LeTryhard or his group obscene amounts of gold for a carry either.
And the thing that REALLY scares Timmy and his toxic friends is maybe…just maybe…the only reason a lot of the people are playing with them in the first place is because their special sandbox of goodies is the best and not because they actually want to play with Timmy.
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I’m aware that damage/health scaling isn’t a panacea as we’ve seen in the past with M+ but scaling can also mean adding mechanics.
Similar to how Zek’vir ?? gets new mechanics to deal with on top of more health and damage.
No… those are two different things. You can throw in the option to increase difficulty via new mechanics, but dont call that the same thing as scaling.
I would also caution against citing zekvir 2 as an example of good content applicable to all players. Especially given the reactions to the fight on these very forums. The design of the fight being solo makes it inherently impossible to balance perfectly. If you push generic delves to high enough levels you will inevitably reach this threshold, at which point it stops being solo, rest I covered above.
The push for gilded crests and myth track from delves will likely continue on the socials for the entirety of tww. I don’t expect things to change unless blizz adopts a radical change in their game design philosophy regarding challenge vs reward depending on content size. The difficulty increase in m+, the reward caps in delves, and the changes to raid crest drops and aura buffs over the duration of the season suggest to me that a larger emphasis is being placed on raids over smaller group and solo content for max level rewards. I generally agree with this approach, although I know a good number of players won’t be happy with it.
it will 100% not be the DEATH of group content. for the simple fact that 90%+ of the players that would engage with it dont step foot into group content to begin with. it would have 0 impact on group content.
all it will do is open up another door for people who does group content to have another avenue to attain gear while giving people who despises group content a way to attain gear without having to deal with groups, and play on their own time.