Crazy how you two are usually in the same threads agreeing with each other and liking each other’s posts. 
If I didn’t know any better I’d say you’re sock puppeting.
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It’s hilarious that people try to post on forum alts but have no idea how easy it is to find mains. lol
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Not even close but ok sure 
. Literally all of my toons have the name Snoz in it.
You clearly don’t know any better.
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Aren’t you the person that made a thread that claimed to have just come back to the game and had all these complaints about how the game is now and got salty that I called you out on actually playing the whole expansion?
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New player/casual is a legitimate description of new players, who always start as casuals with a casual attitude toward the game.
When I first started playing at the end of mop, I knew there was such a thing as a rotation, but had no idea how to determine how to set one up myself.
Guides at that time were useless to a new player, an actual new player who was a low level trying to figure out which of their 3 spells they should use, when any why?
The guides were 10 steps long, with heavy emphasis on mythic tier and raid trinkets. Each step was “if this proc that”, none of which steps or spells I even had.
At least now on icy veins there’s a slider a new player can use to help them understand how to play as they level and get spells.
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I don’t know how casual this game has ever been; the learning curve is steep enough that even if I see idiots, trolls and foolishness: I know that they had to be smart enough to get this far.
I tell it to myself whenever I get stumped on a tough part of the game, “one million people solved this today, I can too” or “one million people downed this boss today, I must be able to do it.”
So, I can’t be sure that this game was ever casual.
There might be weekend warriors; they may not be up to the standard of the players who play every day and read the guides and practice at the target dummies. Those weekend warriors (you’d call them stupid, but they are not) spend too much gold on a legendary because it is part of the game, not to be cutting edge. You can’t call them casual; they have a purpose and an intention when they log in. They are here to get something done, they don’t raid three nights a week for three hours a pop and then chain mythics: they are too smart to get caught in a cycle that never ends. Casual? No.
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It’s a shame I agree. If only they had training dummies. If only they had normal or heroic dungeons…or a simpler version of the raids to let people get a feel for their rotations.
WHY must blizzard HATE casuals???
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No way lol BC was the easiest thing on the planet except for that one raid boss in Sunwell
I see you’re still on duty. You work long shifts.
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Thanks, whatever that means.
I am a hard worker though, I am pleased that you noticed. 
Grincel obliterating people left and right
Also OP why are you claiming casuals can’t follow a dps rotation
Casual doesn’t mean bad
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Classes in MoP required a mastery to play that you earned over time, There wasnt really set rotations. Just like in the older versions of the game there was a way to figure out how to do the most optimal damage in each setting.
This kind of RPG style gameplay was destroyed with the legion homogenization. Making it so that it was almost obvious to figure out the most optimal way to damage.
New players in MoP had the benefit of playing a game that nobody had full mastery and new ways to win and endless scenarios in which gameplay could unfold that even at the highest level didnt become the scripted gameplay weve seen until post legion homogenization.
Grincel reminding me of that slap everyone at the cookout meme
19 different things to do in a rotation as a Shadow Priest… and while you’re trying to accomplish even the task of remembering what to do and when trying to execute that, you’ve got current game design demanding that the ranged break cast every 3 seconds for one reason or another. Whether that’s having to stop yourself because of Quaking, having to move because of Volcanic, boss mechanics like going into the down phase of Anduin and getting stuff spawned underneath you every 2 seconds in the middle of a gigantic race to kill adds that the rest of the fight depends on and I’m sitting here like I CAN’T CAST A GOD DAMN SPELL BECAUSE I CAN’T STOP MOVING. I remember when a lot of bosses weren’t much more than tank n’ spanks, which isn’t the solution either, but this has gone so far the other way that I’ve pretty much had it playing a caster.
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Even for new players though. I’m brand new, start of shadowlands. 3300io right now in Season 3 on my main and over 3k on 2 alts. Rotations are easy to learn.
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Long time WOW players vastly overrate the amount of skill this game takes. I never played wow before shadowlands and got cutting edge by 9.1 and was super close to getting Tormented Hero in S2. I’m not like a top 100 raider by any means but even low end CE and KSH+ is in a fraction of a percentage of players.
This isn’t to say someone with no MMO experience could do this. I’ve yet to encounter content in WOW that’s as difficult as endgame PVE in OSRS (Inferno, trio TOBs, solo NM, etc).
The complexity of the rotations is not what is holding people back though. Once you learn a role (rdps, mdps, melee/ranged heals, and tanking) the rest will be pretty easy.
The players got better so the complexity increased. People want to do more than hit 3 buttons in a certain sequence.
Plus you are reading the OPTIMAL rotation…who is making you be optimal?
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Many people are capable of playing games with more than 4 buttons to remember.
Vanilla is auto attack simulator compared to modern WoW sure but people also willing to buy and play games like Elden Ring these days.
I don’t wanna go back to Vanilla where my aggro dump was dying and reincarnating if I had too many WF procs.
Ovale is a serviceable rotation addon.
I recommend it to any new player or anyone trying a new class.
not perfect, but after awhile you absorb the rotation and no longer need it in most cases.
It really depends on the learning curve of the player.
A fast learner with experience in gaming can quickly grasp WoW’s gameplay.
But a Casual… less play time, who doesnt play often with no gaming experience would have very long learning curve. And they usually get overwhelmed and thought of quitting instead of progressing.
Tank and Spank scenarios, one-button rotation was the gameplay of the old WoW. Casual players like simple stuff and it would work on old WoW gameplay. But WoW has already evolved. Many people dont want boring non-challenging scenarios. WoW’s became complex and way more complex right now compared to old WoW. And the same Casual players who already struggled on old WoW wont be able to comprehend and catch up with modern WoW’s dynamic gameplay.
To me, I want the Casual no-experience players to start at the bottom as modern WoW has level of difficulties. Start at lowest level. Play and learn from them. Keep playing them over and over until your muscle memory improves then step up one notch to higher difficulty. Keep doing this and you would learn how to play. Everyone started as noob. We experienced deaths, wipes, failure over and over. But eventually, we would learn from mistakes… that’s when we start to improve.