I hate how much time I spent this week filling my vault for nothing

[Chantilus-bonechewer]

not wanting to read 3 paragraphs from someone who has nothing of value to say.
Big difference, troll.

[Kiyoko-ravenholdt]

Before the vault you’d get one random dungeon item. Now you get to pick between three or grab a socket. It’s effectively a straight upgrade now, though RNG do be RNG.

[Hpellipsis-whisperwind (Hpellipsis)]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

Second, I do M+. I would do mythic raid (and have done mythic raid end bosses) but I don’t have a team, pugging mythic raid is not super pleasant.

Have you tried pugging this raid by any chance? There’s been 4/8 pugs going since week 2 pretty consistently. I’m doing it on alts now and it takes maybe an hour or two per.

[Briselody-lightnings-blade (Briselody)]

@Chantilus-bonechewer

troll

Irony.

[Sumwun-tichondrius]

omg! I love when I forget about the vault and its surprise goodies.

[Pesa-zangarmarsh]

@Jhaella-maladath

That’s why you don’t fill up your vault. Don’t play the game to fill your vault. Just play the game as you want to, get rewards for doing so but don’t play for the rewards.

This is as much advice to myself as it is advice to you. We’re not vaultmaxxing anymore.

I wish I could be this chill about it. When I play this game I am on a mission. And when I get to the 2 vault slots, I go to 3. I have trouble playing at a medium level. Either I am going like a freight train or not logging in at all

@Myzrym-area-52

I know that the vault isn’t a reliable progression path for mythic track gear from M+. It’s a bonus that will let you have a few mythic pieces by season’s end. That’s it.

Most seasons, I am able to eventually reach something pretty close to max ilvl. Usually there is a stubborn trinket or ring I never get. The gamers here will agree that most people who play M+ at a high level eventually will get near ilvl max from the vault. So every week you don’t get something good is delaying you from the ultimate fun of the game.

Once I get near max ilvl I will start to play a lot more, because I’ll finally be able to see what I can do and how high I can push. In the past I’ve been able to get around what would be 15’s or so today (so like 25/26’s in the past) and your ilvl really matters for these keys because of one thing: stamina!

The burst damage that happens is so high you really need a lot of stamina.

I think one alternate solution would be to simply bring the ilvl up in M+ to max, if you are running 12+ (edit: or maybe just the stamina!)

@Hpellipsis-whisperwind

Have you tried pugging this raid by any chance? There’s been 4/8 pugs going since week 2 pretty consistently.

I have tried both forming my own group (spending 2+ hours in group finder with few people applying) and also get insta-declined from most pugs I apply to. I did get into one pug, and we killed one boss. And then the forums made fun of me for my crap parse.

So not a great experience!

[Xianwae-lightbringer]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

If you do mythic raid, the drops are myth track. If you do M+ the drops are hero track. So mythic raid is much better, you BOTH get the drop chance from the raid itself, AND you get the vault slots.

Mythic raid is much better. Because there are only 8 bosses you can do once a week. I said that. And I didn’t edit anything substantive, lol.

Blizzard’s philosophy is clear, and the bonus from the vault reflects that.

If you Mythic raid, you only have 8 bosses once a week to get loot from. Loot is capped at the difficulty you play. Bonus is bonus so you are guaranteed to get a drop, just might not always be most useful.

Mythic+ is infinitely spammable. Blizzard clearly doesn’t want players to cap out the highest level from spamming mythic+ dungeons. So, the system is you get your drops, and your bonus has a little bit of extra oomph to it, whether it’s Mythic +2 or +10. Mythic tack gear is quite literally the last bit of oomph that can be given. Bonus oomph isn’t progression. Bonus is bonus.

So, fine, get rid of the vault. Mythic+ will then be hard capped at whatever gear they choose to let drop. Then progression will be all internal to the system. Won’t change Blizzard’s stance of not rewarding the highest track for content that is unlimited in attempts for loot vs. the hard lock of raiding.

[Kiyoko-ravenholdt]

Other than trinkets, you can guarantee a 636 item provided you fill 3 vault slots each week by using crafted items (or 2 weeks for a weapon), where you get 1 half-spark free each week and can buy a half-spark. 636 in 14 slots and 626 in 2 slots certainly seems like near-max ilvl.

[Pesa-zangarmarsh]

@Xianwae-lightbringer

So, fine, get rid of the vault. Mythic+ will then be hard capped at whatever gear they choose to let drop.

If they let us run 8 dungeons a week that dropped personal myth track gear, and then after that you didn’t get any gear or it was downgraded to heroic, that would be infinitely better.

But I think they should expand the bullion system to M+

I think the vault should work like this:

Either you luck out and get your “bonus” item, or you take tokens BUT also allow the week’s token to buy a bullion. 2 bullion allows you to buy an awakened track piece of gear from the vendor that can be upgraded all the way, but starts at the bottom.

So, maybe you have to spend time to feed crests into your item to get it up, but at least if you don’t get anything satisfying you’re halfway to getting an item that is desired

Edit: basically the consolation prize isn’t much of a consolation prize because it does not have any path to upgrading your ilvl

[Kiyoko-ravenholdt]

Wait, how are you getting Myth track pieces exactly when you don’t even have Keystone Conqueror this season?

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

But I think they should expand the bullion system to M+

I think the vault should work like this:

Either you luck out or get your “bonus” item, or you take tokens BUT also allow the week’s token to buy a bullion. 2 bullion allows you to buy an awakened track piece of gear from the vendor that can be upgraded all the way, but starts at the bottom.

That’s about what we have now. In 2 weeks you can craft two 636 pieces. This would be 100% targeted loot on one piece and a 636 crafted piece every two weeks, that seems pretty imbalanced against raiding to give perfect item targeting like that. Also it would allow you to get myth-track items off of running world quests and heroic dungeons.

[Commodus-executus]

That is not true because gear is directly tied to “progressing”. Those who do not like M+ or Mythic raiding stop “progressing”. This causes them to start feeling a disconnect from the game and not enjoying it. People need this sense of pushing forward and improving. Blizzard could just as easily give non-raiding, M+ methods for progression for those who don’t like this content or don’t want to deal with the toxicity inherit with those paths. Delves could just keep increasing with difficulty with better gear rewards per difficulty for instance. You could even put them on a shared lock out with raids if you didnt want raiders to be able to raid and do delves in the same week. There are a lot of things that could be that could make both groups happy.

[Hpellipsis-whisperwind (Hpellipsis)]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

If they let us run 8 dungeons a week that dropped personal myth track gear, and then after that you didn’t get any gear or it was downgraded to heroic, that would be infinitely better.

If they did that it’d be likely something like 2x 12, 2x 13, 2x 14, 2x 15. Since it’s not like if you can kill ulgrax you’re necessarily getting to ansurek.

[Canopia-duskwood (Canopia)]

I stopped caring like three weeks ago, now I just do a couple activities then pick the token option to turn in for crests.

[Pesa-zangarmarsh]

@Hpellipsis-whisperwind

If they did that it’d be likely something like 2x 12, 2x 13, 2x 14, 2x 15. Since it’s not like if you can kill ulgrax you’re necessarily getting to ansurek.

Having an increasing key level could work. But a 12 is much harder than Ulgrax. So maybe 2 10’s, then you can do 2 11’s, then 2 12’s, and then 2 13’s

I seem to remember 13 was about the highest key timed when the world first Ansurek kill happened so it could be roughly similar in difficulty. I don’t have any pulls on Ansurek so I can’t say personally

[Kiyoko-ravenholdt]

I’d hesitate to call an untimed 10 Dawnbreaker harder than mythic raid bosses.

[Latsyrc-turalyon (Latsyrc)]

As I’ve said dozens of times before: It’s OK to be done. Take some time off or whatever. Play something else.

I hear No Man’s Sky has a great event going on right now.

[Hpellipsis-whisperwind (Hpellipsis)]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

I seem to remember 13 was about the highest key timed when the world first Ansurek kill happened so it could be roughly similar in difficulty. I don’t have any pulls on Ansurek so I can’t say personally

As someone with pulls on every mythic boss this tier and some higher m+ experience. 11, 11, 12, 12, 13, 13, 14, 15 feels about right.

[Zelebra-zuljin]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

In my opinion the vault is the worst example of wasting player’s time

What about it wastes your time? you can play all the content in game to your liking, and the vault has nothing to do with it, other than giving you an extra piece of gear. don’t like anything? get the tokens and use it for gold or w/e

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

Yeah yeah another thread complaining about getting crap in the vault but isn’t having all of these threads a sign that the system needs to be improved

There is nothing to “improve” its a giant vault that gives you EXTRA loot.

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

I spent so much time last week getting my myth-track vault slots filled

There is your problem. You are doing content, specifically FOR the vault. instead of doing the content FOR the content.

Run your M+ dungeons. Your raids, Your world quests. You are making the mistake in terms of adding the vault as part of the content you are doing, when its simply an extension of rewards.

Just say you didn’t get what you wanted from the vault and move on. lol

[Xianwae-lightbringer]

@Pesa-zangarmarsh

If they let us run 8 dungeons a week that dropped personal myth track gear, and then after that you didn’t get any gear or it was downgraded to heroic, that would be infinitely better.

I don’t have the math behind loot probabilities, but there are less bosses/attempts in a raid than there are when you combine 8 dungeons.

Blizzard ran into this problem because raiders complained that they felt “forced” to do Mythic+ to get gear or progress in raids. I think they’ve been pretty clear they don’t want Mythic+ to end up an easier path to top level gear than raiding, and this was the system they came up with to more compartmentalize the two.

The methods of running them are entirely different. One’s a small group, 30 minute run. The other is, in terms of Mythic, 4x as big of a group size with only 8 bosses max a week, if you are lucky enough to put it on farm. Which most people reasonably cannot do. Not that Mythic+ is easier, but you only need five people for a group.

I don’t know, I didn’t mean to get so snippy. The vault has always been a bonus chance for not getting the drops you wanted. Doesn’t need to be there, nor was it ever a method of progression in of itself. People were tired of constantly running content and getting shafted on drops, so Blizzard added a weekly system of guaranteed drops so you never get zero drops in a week. Usefulness of the drops, no matter the source, will always be RNG. Blizzard has plenty of faults, sometimes I just feel like they could give people a free purple sword and they would complain it isn’t green.

[Hpellipsis-whisperwind (Hpellipsis)]

@Xianwae-lightbringer

I don’t have the math behind loot probabilities, but there are less bosses/attempts in a raid than there are when you combine 8 dungeons.

1/5 per boss kill Vs 2/5 per dungeon.

You could also have it drop to 1/5 for the myth track chances to keep parity.

I have no fundamental issues with mythic+ having a progression track to mythic ilvl. Just every thread that asks for it is something like “Gimme farmable mythic gear from +10s”.

I would say you’re downplaying crafted gear somewhat though. It’s not 100% efficient but we’ve had 5 sparks at this point it’s far from a bad place to put gilded crests.