A group full of 410s weren’t able to use ~16 item level 415 drops?
I’m looking forward to seeing how may Torghast players make the timed rewards without aiming for it. Some people are really capable and just hate what that ticking clock does to their minds.
A ticking clock only encourages enough learning to beat that clock, It does not encourage learning good game play in the least.
I didn’t play legion so I can’t speak to it but I have had friends say it was really good too. Unfortunately I missed it.
Each boss can be summed up in like 4 bullet points.
Gunker
- stand in the bots to not get gooped
-dps out any bots that get gooped
That’s it
Trixie
- interrupt what you can
- use smoke to dodge what you can’t interrupt
-dodge naenos frontal and charges - kill the bosses evenly
That’s it.
What do you want patch work every boss and no mob mechanics?
Cool let’s remove all content that you can fail in because it hurts feelings.
No pvp because you might lose a match.
No dungeons because you might not be able to clear it.
No m+ or raids for same reason.
Or should we “fix” things to not hurt feelings?
Everyone gets gladiator because you can’t ever lose.
Everyone gets to clear any raid difficulty even if they are nowhere near ready for it.
Same for m+.
Everyone gets a participation trophy.
I completely don’t understand not wanting to feel bad for not being able to do something. Having a challenging game is the main reason lots of people play games. It isn’t fun to jump into a game and have nothing to accomplish or strive for, just log in and have everything sat in your lap.
name checks out
I don’t like them either, so I don’t do them. But they should be there for those who do. I just don’t want timers showing up elsewhere COUGH-TORGHAST
If it does I just won’t bother with the content at all.
1 Like
The TBC heroics points are valid. We did love them. But i’d suggest it’d be a relatively small group of players that:
- Loved TBC heroics
- Is still roughly in that same skill percentile (let’s face it, we’re all a lot older)
- Wants removal of timers in m+
From what i’ve seen from the crowd who want removal of timers, they’re usually not doing great in m+. I think that’s a factor we can’t ignore. It’s those who struggle to find groups or complain about people regularly leaving their runs due to timers, scores, etc. There’s one common factor in all of that, and it’s them. We can’t ignore that.
The game has just evolved. Yes, we used to struggle through TBC heroics and still complete them with wipes, etc. They were very challenging content for the time, only the top few % were capable of completing a lot of them. It was like the armani war bear run, a bit of a status symbol. And guess what, that had a timer 
.
But we did that when that was our only option. We only had stats and things to base invites off and there wasn’t an established meta of specs/classes.
Nobody had ever thought of infinite scaling difficulty with timers. I’m pretty confident if you imported the current m+ system back into TBC back in the day, along with raiderIO, people would be running that rather than heroics.
5 Likes
Not a single person in the group received an upgrade from the first four bosses, which was as far as my first group made it. There were plenty of punchards, and random sidegrades, but nothing people were actually equipping.
Contrast that to Kara from Legion, where everything that dropped immediately got slapped onto your character.
I think you nailed it. The geriatric crowd like myself can’t hack high M+. I’ve never done over a 15, and I don’t think we timed the 15 I finished. I didn’t enjoy the experience.
The people unhappy are mostly not that great at the game. I’m pretty good at the PvP side with a zillion BGs played on all classes. If I could just do that part I’d probably have stayed. I can just do that in classic which is why I play that.
By releasing classic / TBC / Wrath my crowd will be kept happy, and they’re probably smarter to engineer retail to fit your preferences.
They should separate competitive M+ and gearing M+. I am not a fan of the eSports push and it needs to get away from this fun game.
I remain under the impression that they only implemented the timers out of desperation. They didn’t believe that the dungeons were enjoyable enough on their own, so they turned it into a race, since people don’t have time to ask themselves if they’re having fun or not when they are racing against a timer.
The “gear is the only reason to play” mentality is the bigger problem here. Rewards should only exist to make it easier/more enjoyable for people to do the content. But we have it mixed up. Right now, the content only exists for people to get rewards, and that’s unfortunate. Some people do M+15s for some random piece of gear in the magic chest and don’t engage with other dungeons for the rest of the week. When the rewards are emphasized instead of the content, people (1) feel like they’re on an infinite treadmill and (2) stop playing when they feel geared enough.
it was and it wasn’t. Tyranical echo of medieve was just ughhh. The amount of do not move you hear and that 1 dps who can’t help himself and wipe the whole party instantly. The you have tyranical moroe who’s just a tank buster.
There’s 4 levels of these dungeons. Only 1 has timers. They pretty clearly intended them to be playable slowly.
2 Likes
I think you Nailed it with this tbh. I have nothing to add 
I agree, and I think that it’s a shame that the other three difficulties become irrelevant once you get to item level 430 or so, especially when casual players like myself can get to ilvl 470+ with ease. I’ve been solo running my friends through heroic dungeons, that’s how trivial the other difficulties are. They need to make the other difficulties relevant again!
Instead of hard timers, they should change M+ to work like the new changes to torments in torghast. The longer you take to finish, the harder it becomes. Not because you are getting debuffed but because the mobs are being buffed.
No, not all content needs to be the same.
No need to reinvent the wheel. M+ works and works well. Tweaks is all it needs not rebuilding ground up.
Those are called mythic dungeons.
No they won’t, they are VERY popular and going nowhere in the near future. M+ isn’t for you, that’s ok.
-
No challenge.
-
“meta”. People will bring the best burst classes to melt bosses before the soft enrage so that’s useless. Timer is what makes it fun. You’ll never see certain classes because poor DPS.
If there were alternate, less-stressful progression paths aside from M+ for those of us who hate timed content, there probably wouldn’t be many complaints about M+. But atm we don’t really have a lot of options in that regard.